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Post by ldubhawksfan on Oct 7, 2021 13:30:48 GMT -6
I thought it was just a smaller dose of the same formulation. What I read about it was that the adult dose is already pretty small, so the kids dose being 1/3 of that is just such a tiny amount of liquid (like 1 ml) that it's not a reasonable amount to accurately measure and administer. So they need to change the suspension. But I thought I did see that they are already producing the kids' vials in anticipation of the approval, just like they did for the adults. I saw the same thing that they we’re manufacturing child vials to make sure the dosages don’t get messed up. My initial thoughts: 1) that’s good, 2) I hope they are working on that right now!
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addymac
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Post by addymac on Oct 7, 2021 13:36:45 GMT -6
My H got his booster, and it's the only shot he had any reaction to. Maybe it's cause he had gotten the flu shot a week prior? It was a little weird. Hrm. MH got his flu shot yesterday and I was going to schedule his booster for Sunday. Maybe I should wait. He had no reaction to either dose other than a sore arm. I got my flu shot on Monday and booster on Friday and I had no issues. My H got both the same day and all he had was a headache that day.
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Post by goldenbird on Oct 7, 2021 13:39:04 GMT -6
Hrm. MH got his flu shot yesterday and I was going to schedule his booster for Sunday. Maybe I should wait. He had no reaction to either dose other than a sore arm. I got my flu shot on Monday and booster on Friday and I had no issues. My H got both the same day and all he had was a headache that day. I think I'll still do it for Sunday. He doesn't have to work on Monday since it's Indigenous People's Day so all he has to do is get DS up and to daycare.
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Post by goldenbird on Oct 7, 2021 13:41:17 GMT -6
I'm going to get mine next Thursday and most likely take a sick day Friday unless I feel great. I haven't actually called in in a year and a half. I always go in and work for awhile if something comes up. So I think I deserve it lol.
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Post by Rusty Red on Oct 7, 2021 13:43:11 GMT -6
My mom has let her antivax sister put the myocarditis earworm in place for DS. I'll have to bookmark those talking points.
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Post by potatocakes on Oct 7, 2021 13:51:25 GMT -6
What I read about it was that the adult dose is already pretty small, so the kids dose being 1/3 of that is just such a tiny amount of liquid (like 1 ml) that it's not a reasonable amount to accurately measure and administer. So they need to change the suspension. But I thought I did see that they are already producing the kids' vials in anticipation of the approval, just like they did for the adults. I saw the same thing that they we’re manufacturing child vials to make sure the dosages don’t get messed up. My initial thoughts: 1) that’s good, 2) I hope they are working on that right now! I think this is what hawkward said from her experience, too.
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Post by sweptaway on Oct 7, 2021 13:57:51 GMT -6
I thought doses got mixed on site but obviously there's tons of room for error there so that makes more sense. And yes I hope they are working on it haha!
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hawkward
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Post by hawkward on Oct 7, 2021 14:16:01 GMT -6
Doses get mixed on site because once the concentrate is thawed we have six hours to use it. When vaccines were still in short supply that was incredibly stressful to worry about wasting doses.
When we reconstitute it’s pulling 1.8 ml of NS to mix in the .45 ml of thawed vaccine concentrate. The dose is already so tiny that we are using backlighting to draw up the .3 ml of vaccine in a VanishPoint needle and it goes through two QCs because “champagne bubbles” are a big problem with those needles. One bubble can make the entire dose wasted (we are not allowed to redraw or mix vials). There are 5-6 doses in a vial depending on leakage from the vial as it’s drawn.
So what we’re doing with the adult dose is already kinda hard, dropping it to one third would be really impractical and unsafe, nor would it be possible to safely reconstitute it at a lower concentration because of the vial. Plus it would just suck to have to give that big of a shot to a little kid.
Pfizer gambled on concurrent production so once the EUA comes it’s just a matter of distribution (which should move pretty quickly given the process is already established). The kits that are distributed to vaccinators won’t have to change either, which will help speed up the process as well.
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Post by ldubhawksfan on Oct 7, 2021 14:22:34 GMT -6
Doses get mixed on site because once the concentrate is thawed we have six hours to use it. When vaccines were still in short supply that was incredibly stressful to worry about wasting doses. When we reconstitute it’s pulling 1.8 ml of NS to mix in the .45 ml of thawed vaccine concentrate. The dose is already so tiny that we are using backlighting to draw up the .3 ml of vaccine in a VanishPoint needle and it goes through two QCs because “champagne bubbles” are a big problem with those needles. One bubble can make the entire dose wasted (we are not allowed to redraw or mix vials). There are 5-6 doses in a vial depending on leakage from the vial as it’s drawn. So what we’re doing with the adult dose is already kinda hard, dropping it to one third would be really impractical and unsafe, nor would it be possible to safely reconstitute it at a lower concentration because of the vial. Plus it would just suck to have to give that big of a shot to a little kid. Pfizer gambled on concurrent production so once the EUA comes it’s just a matter of distribution (which should move pretty quickly given the process is already established). The kits that are distributed to vaccinators won’t have to change either, which will help speed up the process as well. Bless you for your expertise!
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richard
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Post by richard on Oct 7, 2021 14:36:03 GMT -6
Doses get mixed on site because once the concentrate is thawed we have six hours to use it. When vaccines were still in short supply that was incredibly stressful to worry about wasting doses. When we reconstitute it’s pulling 1.8 ml of NS to mix in the .45 ml of thawed vaccine concentrate. The dose is already so tiny that we are using backlighting to draw up the .3 ml of vaccine in a VanishPoint needle and it goes through two QCs because “champagne bubbles” are a big problem with those needles. One bubble can make the entire dose wasted (we are not allowed to redraw or mix vials). There are 5-6 doses in a vial depending on leakage from the vial as it’s drawn. So what we’re doing with the adult dose is already kinda hard, dropping it to one third would be really impractical and unsafe, nor would it be possible to safely reconstitute it at a lower concentration because of the vial. Plus it would just suck to have to give that big of a shot to a little kid. Pfizer gambled on concurrent production so once the EUA comes it’s just a matter of distribution (which should move pretty quickly given the process is already established). The kits that are distributed to vaccinators won’t have to change either, which will help speed up the process as well.
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hawkward
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Post by hawkward on Oct 7, 2021 14:51:27 GMT -6
Y’all already know how I can nerd out on something. I’m in my element in the back room of the vaccine clinic. Numbers and compounds sharp things, and very little non-geek interaction. I love it.
I hate the necessity, of course, but science we zoomed forward is fascinating.
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Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Oct 7, 2021 14:59:42 GMT -6
I read an article that said that there will be a hold up (in Canada at least) while we wait for the 5-11 doses to be manufactured, as we can't just draw them from the adult formulation. They might have already started ramping up production in the US, though. I am sure you will get doses quicker than we will. I thought it was just a smaller dose of the same formulation. It is, but I guess they can’t draw the smaller doses from the regular vials because it would be too high risk for bacterial contamination with the number of times the vial gets punctured for making kid doses vs adult doses, more punctures = more risk of contamination. And I think I read it’s harder to draw doses for the size kids need from the adult vials too. Idk. FIX IT! Please.
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hawkward
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Post by hawkward on Oct 7, 2021 15:08:16 GMT -6
I thought it was just a smaller dose of the same formulation. It is, but I guess they can’t draw the smaller doses from the regular vials because it would be too high risk for bacterial contamination with the number of times the vial gets punctured for making kid doses vs adult doses, more punctures = more risk of contamination. And I think I read it’s harder to draw doses for the size kids need from the adult vials too. Idk. FIX IT! Please. The bacterial risk is actually pretty low because of the time frame. BUT it also relies on best practices being used consistently, so…
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Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Oct 7, 2021 15:28:15 GMT -6
It is, but I guess they can’t draw the smaller doses from the regular vials because it would be too high risk for bacterial contamination with the number of times the vial gets punctured for making kid doses vs adult doses, more punctures = more risk of contamination. And I think I read it’s harder to draw doses for the size kids need from the adult vials too. Idk. FIX IT! Please. The bacterial risk is actually pretty low because of the time frame. BUT it also relies on best practices being used consistently, so… Yeah that makes sense. It was some science persons explanation of why Canada cant just use the doses we already have, I guess with kids they are just not willing to FAFO and that’s probably best.
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hawkward
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Post by hawkward on Oct 7, 2021 15:36:01 GMT -6
The bacterial risk is actually pretty low because of the time frame. BUT it also relies on best practices being used consistently, so… Yeah that makes sense. It was some science persons explanation of why Canada cant just use the doses we already have, I guess with kids they are just not willing to FAFO and that’s probably best. OH, never mind. I get it now. For the kids’ dose that would be 15-18 doses PLUS you’d either have to separate out vials or syringe mix. Cross contamination would be basically impossible to avoid. So you’d wear out the integrity of the seal pretty quickly. That makes sense.
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Post by frantastic on Oct 7, 2021 16:59:25 GMT -6
Y’all already know how I can nerd out on something. I’m in my element in the back room of the vaccine clinic. Numbers and compounds sharp things, and very little non-geek interaction. I love it. I hate the necessity, of course, but science we zoomed forward is fascinating. Talk nerdy to me!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 20:31:11 GMT -6
Yeah that makes sense. It was some science persons explanation of why Canada cant just use the doses we already have, I guess with kids they are just not willing to FAFO and that’s probably best. OH, never mind. I get it now. For the kids’ dose that would be 15-18 doses PLUS you’d either have to separate out vials or syringe mix. Cross contamination would be basically impossible to avoid. So you’d wear out the integrity of the seal pretty quickly. That makes sense. What if you drew up with a sub q needle and then swapped out? I do this sometimes when I'm in an isolation room and run out of 22s for drawing up meds. It would save the integrity of the seal, our insulin vials last for 50+ administrations. Easier to draw up an exact amount and avoid air bubbles, too.
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hawkward
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Post by hawkward on Oct 8, 2021 5:49:03 GMT -6
OH, never mind. I get it now. For the kids’ dose that would be 15-18 doses PLUS you’d either have to separate out vials or syringe mix. Cross contamination would be basically impossible to avoid. So you’d wear out the integrity of the seal pretty quickly. That makes sense. What if you drew up with a sub q needle and then swapped out? I do this sometimes when I'm in an isolation room and run out of 22s for drawing up meds. It would save the integrity of the seal, our insulin vials last for 50+ administrations. Easier to draw up an exact amount and avoid air bubbles, too. It would be possible but then you’d still be running into the practicality of it. They’d have to change the vax clinic kits. In a vaccine clinic, we’re drawing up hundreds of shots an hour. In a regular office, they probably wouldn’t be able to go through them quickly enough to avoid wasting doses. The safest solution would still be to change the vials. And they’re under so much scrutiny right now I imagine they’re gearing things toward the lowest common denominator more than usual. I haven’t seen the vials yet but I’m guessing they’ll be even more clearly marked as peds than normal meds.
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Post by goldenbird on Oct 8, 2021 6:51:14 GMT -6
I scheduled my booster for next Thursday at 10am. At a CVS inside a Target so I guess I'll need to browse Target post shot. 😌
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Post by AnnPerkins on Oct 8, 2021 8:39:25 GMT -6
King Gutter Baby said the FDA has a hearing (meeting?) scheduled for October 26 to debate EUA approval. I cannot take you seriously when you say "King Gutter Baby said..." She just changed her IG handle to her real name to be more professional😢 She'll always be KGB to me.
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brux
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Post by brux on Oct 8, 2021 8:40:01 GMT -6
I cannot take you seriously when you say "King Gutter Baby said..." She just changed her IG handle to her real name to be more professional😢 She'll always be KGB to me. nooo! She made it so long as KGB!
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brux
Diamond
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Post by brux on Oct 8, 2021 9:07:51 GMT -6
I just looked this up for my own knowledge, so I figured I'd share it here in case anyone was interested.
Pfizer applied for EUA for the vaccine for 16 and up on 11/20/2020. An independent panel voted on 12/10/2020 to approve EUA, and the FDA agreed with that vote (they weren't obligated to). The first American to be vaccinated under the EUA was on 12/14/2020.
Pfizer applied for EUA for the vaccine 12-15 year olds on 4/9/2021. The FDA approved the EUA usage on 5/10/2021. The CDC met on 5/12/2021 to discuss recommendations on how the vaccine should be administered, and released their guidelines on 5/14/2021. Most states allowed shots for that age on 5/13/2021.
For the 5-11 year olds, Pfizer applied for EUA on 10/7/2021. An independent panel is scheduled to discuss approval on 10/26/2021.
So if everything goes according to history...shots in arms the first week of November.
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Post by donnamoss on Oct 8, 2021 9:31:01 GMT -6
Haven’t been in here much lately. Apologies if it’s been addressed. Does anyone know where Moderna is in terms of booster evaluation and approval?
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Post by greykitty on Oct 8, 2021 9:33:23 GMT -6
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Post by aeroplaneoverthesea on Oct 8, 2021 12:06:05 GMT -6
Our school is offering optional clear desk shields. Our district is mandatory masks, although the teachers are pretty liberal with breaks. Everything I’ve read suggests dividers/shields aren’t really helpful. Thoughts?
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AmyG
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Post by AmyG on Oct 8, 2021 12:29:06 GMT -6
Our school is offering optional clear desk shields. Our district is mandatory masks, although the teachers are pretty liberal with breaks. Everything I’ve read suggests dividers/shields aren’t really helpful. Thoughts? If you have a clear desk shield and covid gets in there it traps it next to you due to disruption of air flow. So um if you get a desk shield can you get an air purifier or fan with high merv filter or something like that for your desk area? How close are your desks? Is there good airflow/fans already? Is it high occupancy office? Is everyone vaccinated?
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hawkward
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Post by hawkward on Oct 8, 2021 12:33:04 GMT -6
Our school is offering optional clear desk shields. Our district is mandatory masks, although the teachers are pretty liberal with breaks. Everything I’ve read suggests dividers/shields aren’t really helpful. Thoughts? I dunno, I don’t think I’d bother. It’s not going to stop air flow, only direct droplet spray.
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Post by aeroplaneoverthesea on Oct 8, 2021 13:01:04 GMT -6
Our school is offering optional clear desk shields. Our district is mandatory masks, although the teachers are pretty liberal with breaks. Everything I’ve read suggests dividers/shields aren’t really helpful. Thoughts? If you have a clear desk shield and covid gets in there it traps it next to you due to disruption of air flow. So um if you get a desk shield can you get an air purifier or fan with high merv filter or something like that for your desk area? How close are your desks? Is there good airflow/fans already? Is it high occupancy office? Is everyone vaccinated? It’d be for our 8 year old, the have Individual desks 3ft apart. They keep classroom windows open for now. My gut was to skip it, sounds like that’s correct.
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sewf
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Post by sewf on Oct 9, 2021 17:24:40 GMT -6
Well, it finally happened - a customer came in to the store I work at, refused to mask (even though there is a mask mandate in our city AND county, and two of my coworkers were assaulted. They are fine, luckily: the guy threw one of my coworkers' phone, and he hit my manager. I was on break, so I don't know if he swung at her or if he was just throwing his arm our or something. Either way, the police came, the guy got away before they got there, and my manager was checked out by an ambulance.
People fucking suck. I'm having a drink and trying to drown my anxiety.
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Post by goldenbird on Oct 9, 2021 17:26:44 GMT -6
sewf I'm so sorry. People are fucking assholes.
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