willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 12, 2023 17:42:54 GMT -6
After the 2015 In Touch article that blew the Pest stuff wide open, Jill started getting nightmares every day replaying the abuse. She said she had repressed it until that point.
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bobyn
Diamond
local baby-making menace
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Post by bobyn on Sept 12, 2023 18:22:49 GMT -6
Loving mothers don't blanket train and parentify their children. Oh I don't disagree. I am just speaking from what appears to be Jill's perspective and memories of her mother while she was young. I am only like 30 pages in so that could also change! Sorry, I understand! I'll put my pitchfork away 😂
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 12, 2023 18:25:12 GMT -6
Jill was terrified to do the Megyn Kelly interview but she felt she had to as one of the older children and as a way to “prove her love” to her parents. After Jill said she’d do it, then Jessa also volunteered. And then Josh said thank you to them. And she said it was pure agony to do the interview especially with Josh sitting right there watching them.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 12, 2023 18:31:22 GMT -6
The Ashley Madison story broke while Jill and Derick were in El Salvador and she decided to text Pest directly to ask him if it was true. He never replied to her.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 12, 2023 18:36:34 GMT -6
Jill says she got very sad after the Ashley Madison stuff after seeing the lengths in which her dad was going to protect the Pest and get him into a rehab without the press finding him, etc. She said she felt like there was a clear imbalance in priority.
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Post by sassafras83 on Sept 12, 2023 18:54:32 GMT -6
Jill was terrified to do the Megyn Kelly interview but she felt she had to as one of the older children and as a way to “prove her love” to her parents. After Jill said she’d do it, then Jessa also volunteered. And then Josh said thank you to them. And she said it was pure agony to do the interview especially with Josh sitting right there watching them. The fact they allowed Josh to be in the room for that makes it even more disgusting.
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Post by beesquared on Sept 12, 2023 19:31:17 GMT -6
I’m not sure if I can stomach reading Jill’s book, but I am so glad she isn’t holding back on her truth. Even if she doesn’t see things through the same lens as us outsiders, she has enough perspective to see the bullshit. Recognizing the messed up stuff is the first step in breaking the cycle. She’s not raising her kids in the same cult, and I’m glad for that.*
*I want more for her than just that, but I also recognize that she’s a white lady in the south.
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Post by Hotcoconuts82 on Sept 13, 2023 5:53:58 GMT -6
I’m not sure if I can stomach reading Jill’s book, but I am so glad she isn’t holding back on her truth. Even if she doesn’t see things through the same lens as us outsiders, she has enough perspective to see the bullshit. Recognizing the messed up stuff is the first step in breaking the cycle. She’s not raising her kids in the same cult, and I’m glad for that.* *I want more for her than just that, but I also recognize that she’s a white lady in the south. She's still young, and learning to not hate everyone. I have hope she can still make changes.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 9:18:44 GMT -6
When JB was visiting Derick and Jill in El Salvador, Derick brought up being paid for future appearances on the show. This is where JB made the comment where he asked Derick what he was wanting to get paid, "10 or 12 dollars an hour" like he was "paying others" that were working for him. Derick responded by asking how much the show was worth, and asked how much JB was making off the show, because he couldn't properly assess how much he as a "worker" was worth to the "business" without knowing how much the business was worth.
That pissed JB off. He obviously didn't answer. Jill said Derick was respectful, calm and polite during the whole conversation. He pointed out that the new show was called JILL and Jessa Counting On, as well.
Later, when a new season was going to start, the producers wanted Jill and Derick to return to the US for a shoot and they had already committed to a certain time period in El Salvador for their mission and they refused. JB called them and was apparently SUPER PISSED and started asking Jill if Derick was the reason they weren't coming back and then told Derick he was causing his wife to go back on her word and that Derick was leading his family down a path of destruction.
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Post by Hotcoconuts82 on Sept 13, 2023 9:26:49 GMT -6
When JB was visiting Derick and Jill in El Salvador, Derick brought up being paid for future appearances on the show. This is where JB made the comment where he asked Derick what he was wanting to get paid, "10 or 12 dollars an hour" like he was "paying others" that were working for him. Derick responded by asking how much the show was worth, and asked how much JB was making off the show, because he couldn't properly assess how much he as a "worker" was worth to the "business" without knowing how much the business was worth. That pissed JB off. He obviously didn't answer. Jill said Derick was respectful, calm and polite during the whole conversation. He pointed out that the new show was called JILL and Jessa Counting On, as well. Later, when a new season was going to start, the producers wanted Jill and Derick to return to the US for a shoot and they had already committed to a certain time period in El Salvador for their mission and they refused. JB called them and was apparently SUPER PISSED and started asking Jill if Derick was the reason they weren't coming back and then told Derick he was causing his wife to go back on her word and that Derick was leading his family down a path of destruction. Lololol JB really shot himself in the foot by finding his daughter a college educated man. This is why the cult wants the kids to stay uneducated.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 11:15:10 GMT -6
Soon after Jill and Derick returned from El Salvador, JB had them come to a family meeting with the other older siblings and offered them $80k each (or, per couple) and said they were going to draft up an "agreement" to go with it. The agreement was written from Mad Family Inc, not TLC, which was a company that JB and Michelle had started. The contract gave them $80k in exchange for agreeing that themselves AND their children or future children not yet born, would be made available for filming for the next seven years, and an unlimited number of years after that if the company chose to keep going. They would be paid for their future work but it would be at a rate that was decided and could not be negotiated, and they would have to sign an NDA that would remain active for the rest of their lives.
Derick and Jill (obviously) didn't sign it. JB showed up one day a few months later with a check for 80k and said they could keep it and they would draw up an agreement later.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 11:17:19 GMT -6
JB did eventually verbally apologize to Jill for making her sign the contract that kept her obligated to the show without letting her know what she was signing.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 11:22:47 GMT -6
Jill and Derick wanted to continue with their missionary work and had gotten through a long approval process to work with a large international organization, but first they had to be released from the TLC contract in order to go forward. They called Jill's parents first, and then emailed all of TLC and producers, etc. The fallout was instantaneous and the network continued to try and not let them see the rest of the contract that Jill had signed when they pushed back about them wanting to leave the show.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 11:26:34 GMT -6
One of the producers was on the Board that Jill and Derick created for their "Dillard Family Ministries" business and after J&D wanted to leave the show, he told them was resigning. Then, immediately afterward, the producer withdrew all but a few hundred dollars in their business account. When confronted, he told them it was to cover "CPA" costs, even though those costs were supposed to come out from what they were already paying him.
Just so low and dirty to do that to them, when reportedly that was basically all the income they had at the time and Jill was pregnant with their second.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 11:40:03 GMT -6
Jill writes about the extremely traumatic birth of her second child and how for a while they didn't know whether the brain bleed would cause permanent developmental delays for the baby. They found out there was no remaining scarring or anything on a scan when he was 3 months old which was apparently very rare and good news. Then she made a comment to her friend in the vicinity of JB about how she might not be able to have more kids (because her uterus ruptured and she had 2 c sections plus the trauma caused to the baby) and JB just said "Well we don't know about that do we?"
She said she had to bite back from asking him what business it was of his to comment on the state of HER uterus. Which after I read that I was like "Ok Jill, we might make a liberal out of you yet.."
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 11:54:30 GMT -6
Jill talks about how after she and Derick started going to a non IBLP church and she saw how people there dressed very differently, had tattoos, etc, she started thinking about wearing pants. She was too afraid of it being considered disobeying her parents. Derick told her he didn't think it was a sin. Then Jinger started wearing pants first so she called Jinger and Jinger told her that she got a bit of private backlash but that it was worth it and encouraged Jill to do it if she wanted.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 13:46:14 GMT -6
Jill decided to wear leggings for the first time with a long tshirt to an amusement park in Branson with Derick and some friends, and the rest of her family just so happened to show up that same day at the amusement park so she spent the time trying to hide her lower half from them when they crossed paths. She said the person she took a selfie with tagged her online and then JB confronted her about it saying that at least Jinger had called and talked to them first about her decision to wear pants. He gave her a book about modesty.
Jill then decided to get her nose pierced because she thought it looked cute. She called her parents and left JB a voicemail, and spoke directly to Michelle who said thanks for letting me know and that was it. When she was done with the piercing, she had a long angry voicemail from JB saying that he couldn't believe she would do this, think about what how it will affect her little sisters, and that she was ruining her life.
She said after that, her relationship with her dad became constantly difficult. He would send her messages about honoring her parents and other guilt trips constantly. She sent him a long text explaining how she loves him and her mom and that she wants to have a good relationship with them and her siblings but that she wants them to respect her and Derick's differences in how they choose to live their lives going forward. She said she doesn't want to have conversations where she feels like she will be verbally abused and manipulated. She hoped that this message would get JB to apologize. She said instead, JB dug in and the fear and guilt became overwhelming for her.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 13:54:57 GMT -6
Whoa. Jill said she and Derick sent JB a 27 page letter airing all their grievances. He replied with a short email apologizing and saying he didn't mean to hurt them.
Then basically right after, J&D got a letter from the IRS. Derick did a bunch of digging and found out that JB had been telling their CPA (the family paid CPA did Jill's taxes for her and Derick as well) for years that Jill was making money off the show. Like over $130,000. The CPA seemed to imply he thought they knew all of what JB had been reporting to him. When they confronted JB, he accused them of having "a spirit of ungratefulness". Derick said that if they were in fact earning income, they should be able to tithe on it. JB said if they wanted to tithe on their income, he would have to kick out families that were living rent free in some of his properties. JB asked what Jill and Derick felt they were "owed", like he was daring them to come up with a number.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 14:09:31 GMT -6
After the letter, J&D agreed to meet with JB& Michelle with a mediator present to try and reconcile things. But it quickly escalated when JB got really angry and demanded an apology for Jill saying he was verbally abusive. He got up in their faces and was yelling and saying she was guilty. She told him she was upset because she feels as though JB thinks she's a horrible person because she wears pants and has a nose ring, and she's being treated like a prodigal who is turning her back on her parents. That is then where she told him that he treats her "worse than you treat [her] pedophile brother."
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 14:37:34 GMT -6
I just finished the book. She talks a lot about how helpful her therapist has been to show her how she can process her trauma and reconcile both the good and bad experiences in her childhood/young adult life. She confirms that she believes that Pest deserves to be in prison and that she is sickened by his actions. She says her relationship with her dad is still awkward but she does genuinely want to keep improving it over time, though she's not going to compromise her convictions or go back to how things used to be. She said the Pest case has also made more of her younger siblings start to open their eyes a bit as well and ask more questions.
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Post by unicornofthesea on Sept 13, 2023 16:21:11 GMT -6
willow thanks for doing the Cliff notes!!
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 13, 2023 17:02:04 GMT -6
Oh one other thing I forgot. At one point, after their big blow up with the mediator, JB wrote them a letter. He made an itemized list of all the things he provided for Jill over the years and how much it cost, so that he could add it all up and say that everything he’s provided for her was almost exactly $130k, conveniently the amount he claimed she earned to the IRS. It was super bullshit stuff too like the harp he bought for her for $15k, gas money, money for eating out, etc. Like making it seem as though that was her payment for being in the show. It was so gross.
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Post by Hotcoconuts82 on Sept 13, 2023 17:44:24 GMT -6
Oh one other thing I forgot. At one point, after their big blow up with the mediator, JB wrote them a letter. He made an itemized list of all the things he provided for Jill over the years and how much it cost, so that he could add it all up and say that everything he’s provided for her was almost exactly $130k, conveniently the amount he claimed she earned to the IRS. It was super bullshit stuff too like the harp he bought for her for $15k, gas money, money for eating out, etc. Like making it seem as though that was her payment for being in the show. It was so gross. Oh the stuff you pay for AS A PARENT? f*ck off Jb!! What an ass. I wonder how much M is in on all of this. Or is she just a hostage more or less.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 14, 2023 6:25:48 GMT -6
Oh one other thing I forgot. At one point, after their big blow up with the mediator, JB wrote them a letter. He made an itemized list of all the things he provided for Jill over the years and how much it cost, so that he could add it all up and say that everything he’s provided for her was almost exactly $130k, conveniently the amount he claimed she earned to the IRS. It was super bullshit stuff too like the harp he bought for her for $15k, gas money, money for eating out, etc. Like making it seem as though that was her payment for being in the show. It was so gross. Oh the stuff you pay for AS A PARENT? f*ck off Jb!! What an ass. I wonder how much M is in on all of this. Or is she just a hostage more or less. Yeah, I mean, some of it was definitely things you wouldn't normally pay for as a parent with normal income but as a millionaire, sure, it was nothing compared to what he was actually bringing in from the show. Just really sad how selfish he was about his own kids. Not surprising at all though.
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 14, 2023 6:27:55 GMT -6
As far as whether Michelle was involved, the way Jill writes the book makes it seem more like Michelle was the good cop to the bad cop, sort of thing, but also that Michelle clearly had no say over what was going to happen nor did she try and do anything to stop what JB would say/do. To be fair, by that point she'd been brainwashed for decades and to go against her husband is very much against the rules. Jill talked a LOT about how much the IBLP brainwashing really fucked with her brain and gave her severe anxiety over doing even the slightest thing against her parents wishes, so, it is definitely a thing.
Jill also outright calls IBLP a cult toward the end as well.
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Post by Hotcoconuts82 on Sept 14, 2023 6:33:46 GMT -6
Oh the stuff you pay for AS A PARENT? f*ck off Jb!! What an ass. I wonder how much M is in on all of this. Or is she just a hostage more or less. Yeah, I mean, some of it was definitely things you wouldn't normally pay for as a parent with normal income but as a millionaire, sure, it was nothing compared to what he was actually bringing in from the show. Just really sad how selfish he was about his own kids. Not surprising at all though. I remember after her second birth, Jill was looking for tlc to pay some of the hospital bills. I cannot imagine my child and grandchild almost dying and I'm sitting on $$$$ and I don't offer to help.
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Post by Hotcoconuts82 on Sept 14, 2023 6:34:27 GMT -6
As far as whether Michelle was involved, the way Jill writes the book makes it seem more like Michelle was the good cop to the bad cop, sort of thing, but also that Michelle clearly had no say over what was going to happen nor did she try and do anything to stop what JB would say/do. To be fair, by that point she'd been brainwashed for decades and to go against her husband is very much against the rules. Jill talked a LOT about how much the IBLP brainwashing really fucked with her brain and gave her severe anxiety over doing even the slightest thing against her parents wishes, so, it is definitely a thing. Jill also outright calls IBLP a cult toward the end as well. I'm sure Michelle has no access to any bank accounts.
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addymac
Emerald
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Post by addymac on Sept 14, 2023 10:26:45 GMT -6
The thing that irks me about Michelle though is that even if she was brainwashed, she didn’t grow up brainwashed and she chose to go into this cult and knows that life can be different. It almost makes it worse, to me, that you know life can be different and yet you stand by and let your kids suffer in this way.
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claudia
Sapphire
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Post by claudia on Sept 14, 2023 10:55:24 GMT -6
Oh the stuff you pay for AS A PARENT? f*ck off Jb!! What an ass. I wonder how much M is in on all of this. Or is she just a hostage more or less. Yeah, I mean, some of it was definitely things you wouldn't normally pay for as a parent with normal income but as a millionaire, sure, it was nothing compared to what he was actually bringing in from the show. Just really sad how selfish he was about his own kids. Not surprising at all though. I saw the list (I'm only about a third of the way through the audiobook) and some of it was basically expenses from when she was still a kid - like I feel like I did the math and he was counting food from when she was 16 years old. So she legally was your responsibility, she by your religion was still under your authority, but you're itemizing her food and claiming it was income?
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willow
Ruby
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Post by willow on Sept 14, 2023 12:31:25 GMT -6
The thing that irks me about Michelle though is that even if she was brainwashed, she didn’t grow up brainwashed and she chose to go into this cult and knows that life can be different. It almost makes it worse, to me, that you know life can be different and yet you stand by and let your kids suffer in this way. So, I get this perspective BUT I also think it is important to recognize the real and lasting psychological effects that cults have on people. Cults have plenty of people who start out in the "normal" real world and then get sucked in by one thing or another. JB also was not raised IBLP either. I do not absolve Michelle of all wrongdoing but I also think she sincerely believed she was doing right for her kids based on the IBLP teachings.
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