richard
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Post by richard on Apr 18, 2021 7:04:00 GMT -6
I do like everything else they’re doing with the show.
It just feels like Karli’s storyline got the short stick. They needed a villain to chase to advance the other storylines. But the upheaval from the Blip and social impacts could’ve been it’s own show.
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willow
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Post by willow on Apr 18, 2021 7:38:48 GMT -6
richard I completely agree with you and it’s why I just don’t even really care about that storyline. I just want to watch them fight Walker now, ha.
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richard
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Post by richard on Apr 18, 2021 8:09:45 GMT -6
richard I completely agree with you and it’s why I just don’t even really care about that storyline. I just want to watch them fight Walker now, ha. I keep trying and failing, lol. I think that’s a big difference with a movie vs. a show. It wouldn’t have phased me in a movie because you don’t take week-long breaks and sit around thinking about the plot while locked in your house. |
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willow
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Post by willow on Apr 18, 2021 8:23:15 GMT -6
But I’m saying why would they even be refugees?? It doesn’t make sense. Karli survives Blip. Living her life with her bank account and worldly possessions intact. People come back from Blip. Say Karli is living in someone who returns home now...instead of her, the one with money, finding a new place (when half of the housing stock in the country sits empty), her government sends her and “millions” of people with bank accounts and jobs to camps in other countries. So okay, pretend that makes sense. Karli would hate the Global Council. But now she’s going to bomb a place for voting on an act that would end the camps and send people back to their home countries. And you’re telling me the middle-aged American white man with the latte in the park is on Karli’s side??? I don't think this is what they're saying though. The people blip and the world goes into chaos. In all of that, borders come down because there are so many people missing. People who may have been in really shitty places, either before the blip or because of, find new lives. And then the GRC, which is shady as fuck, comes along to change everything. Karli has said that are the blip, people who didn't have power were able to start rising up. But now the same (rich white dudes) will be making all the decisions again. I do think it would have helped to give more details about Karli's life pre/during the blip, and what Donya did for her. I just see where she's coming from. There's probably an article out there that explains it better than I have 😂 I think you just did a better explanation than the show has because I have not gotten that from her at all, lol. |
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richard
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Post by richard on Apr 18, 2021 8:28:34 GMT -6
But I’m saying why would they even be refugees?? It doesn’t make sense. Karli survives Blip. Living her life with her bank account and worldly possessions intact. People come back from Blip. Say Karli is living in someone who returns home now...instead of her, the one with money, finding a new place (when half of the housing stock in the country sits empty), her government sends her and “millions” of people with bank accounts and jobs to camps in other countries. So okay, pretend that makes sense. Karli would hate the Global Council. But now she’s going to bomb a place for voting on an act that would end the camps and send people back to their home countries. And you’re telling me the middle-aged American white man with the latte in the park is on Karli’s side??? I don't think this is what they're saying though. The people blip and the world goes into chaos. In all of that, borders come down because there are so many people missing. People who may have been in really shitty places, either before the blip or because of, find new lives. And then the GRC, which is shady as fuck, comes along to change everything. Karli has said that are the blip, people who didn't have power were able to start rising up. But now the same (rich white dudes) will be making all the decisions again. I do think it would have helped to give more details about Karli's life pre/during the blip, and what Donya did for her. I just see where she's coming from. There's probably an article out there that explains it better than I have 😂 So they moved first, willingly, and then were displaced and people in their adopted country cared about the situation of their returned citizens first. That makes so much more sense. Thank you for this because now I can rest. |
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Post by greykitty on Apr 18, 2021 9:19:29 GMT -6
I feel conflicted....I realize Karli is supposed to be an ambiguous character and that we're supposed to see the effects of the serum (that she misappropriated, just like John Walker) in her and her group, as well as the great things they aspire to. But I really just don't care about her - actually, I'm rooting against her. Kind of hoping the Power Broker gets her - which actually might make her a martyr and do more for the good for her cause down the road.
Then I think of how little I cared about Zemo in Civil War - even if he arguably was by far the greater 'villain' than whatever Karli's done to date, even if he also had some good reasons on his side for all his machinations which had so much damaging human collateral. And now I'm all far more worried about how they're getting Zemo off that Raft to return to the MCU soon.
John Walker? Honestly, I give so much credit to Wyatt Russell for making us hate John Walker, yet see some of the nuances while we hate him. I'm not sure how many actors could have pulled that off.
And I'm certainly more invested in 'Sharon Carter - good or bad' than I am in Karli - and Agent 13 is another one I never really cared about much.
To be honest, and I have to go find that fan fiction story now, there was a story that explored a fair bit about how the Blip affected society, and in this story, cast the Returneds as the ones being legally discriminated against by those who Stayed, and worked to keep society going in that five year period. I think that made me more sympathetic to the Returneds here than I might have been going 'cold' into the story.
And even in six hours (or the bit we had in WandaVision or Far From Home) not a lot of time to explore all the ramifications, on everyone. I suspect there's no 100% 'right' side.
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Cheshie6
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Post by Cheshie6 on Apr 18, 2021 9:31:14 GMT -6
But I’m saying why would they even be refugees?? It doesn’t make sense. Karli survives Blip. Living her life with her bank account and worldly possessions intact. People come back from Blip. Say Karli is living in someone who returns home now...instead of her, the one with money, finding a new place (when half of the housing stock in the country sits empty), her government sends her and “millions” of people with bank accounts and jobs to camps in other countries. So okay, pretend that makes sense. Karli would hate the Global Council. But now she’s going to bomb a place for voting on an act that would end the camps and send people back to their home countries. And you’re telling me the middle-aged American white man with the latte in the park is on Karli’s side??? I don't think this is what they're saying though. The people blip and the world goes into chaos. In all of that, borders come down because there are so many people missing. People who may have been in really shitty places, either before the blip or because of, find new lives. And then the GRC, which is shady as fuck, comes along to change everything. Karli has said that are the blip, people who didn't have power were able to start rising up. But now the same (rich white dudes) will be making all the decisions again. I do think it would have helped to give more details about Karli's life pre/during the blip, and what Donya did for her. I just see where she's coming from. There's probably an article out there that explains it better than I have 😂 This is how I saw it too! Also, that without all that "old power," everyone was on equal footing. There was no reason for borders, and walls. Plus, if I remember correctly, Karli did say there was a sense of "togetherness!" Countries probably needed people for business, for agriculture, etc. and there were probably open borders. With all the people back from the blip, having not aged a day from when they left, and thinking power structures were the same as they left... it's confusing. Worse, they seem to have let the people who returned from the Blip (and those who missed having power) just take it back like the 5 years didn't happen. To me, they are doing to Karli, what they did to Killmonger, and Thanos, which is making the people who care about the important stuff, but due to their tactics, the villains. And I can see this playing out in our time now. How BLM, Native Peoples, anyone who "wants to take your rights away" to save the planet, are vilified. Especially by their tactics. How many times is BLM told they are protesting wrong? This then gets into our psyche and it doesn't surprise me that we have half the population thinking the way they do. As "forward" as Hollywood can seem, they still have a lot of work to do! |
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Post by pianolove on Apr 18, 2021 9:50:33 GMT -6
But I’m saying why would they even be refugees?? It doesn’t make sense. Karli survives Blip. Living her life with her bank account and worldly possessions intact. People come back from Blip. Say Karli is living in someone who returns home now...instead of her, the one with money, finding a new place (when half of the housing stock in the country sits empty), her government sends her and “millions” of people with bank accounts and jobs to camps in other countries. So okay, pretend that makes sense. Karli would hate the Global Council. But now she’s going to bomb a place for voting on an act that would end the camps and send people back to their home countries. And you’re telling me the middle-aged American white man with the latte in the park is on Karli’s side??? I don't think this is what they're saying though. The people blip and the world goes into chaos. In all of that, borders come down because there are so many people missing. People who may have been in really shitty places, either before the blip or because of, find new lives. And then the GRC, which is shady as fuck, comes along to change everything. Karli has said that are the blip, people who didn't have power were able to start rising up. But now the same (rich white dudes) will be making all the decisions again.I do think it would have helped to give more details about Karli's life pre/during the blip, and what Donya did for her. I just see where she's coming from. There's probably an article out there that explains it better than I have 😂 I agree with all of this. To the bolded, to me it's a really good reason why the average joe is willing to fight with the flagsmashers. When the world got a taste of a more equitable life and everyone working together, and then it's ripped away, I can see it.
It does make me excited for the next phase. If they don't do backstory of Donya Madani and Karli's life in this last episode, I really hope to see it in the future. Personally I hope to see more of post-blip life and reacclimation, and the public's view of superheroes now. In Civil War, public sentiment was very much about how dangerous they are, Sokovia Accords, etc. but in Far From Home, they were so willing to accept Mysterio. I gotta watch that one again.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Apr 18, 2021 9:52:24 GMT -6
I don't think this is what they're saying though. The people blip and the world goes into chaos. In all of that, borders come down because there are so many people missing. People who may have been in really shitty places, either before the blip or because of, find new lives. And then the GRC, which is shady as fuck, comes along to change everything. Karli has said that are the blip, people who didn't have power were able to start rising up. But now the same (rich white dudes) will be making all the decisions again.I do think it would have helped to give more details about Karli's life pre/during the blip, and what Donya did for her. I just see where she's coming from. There's probably an article out there that explains it better than I have 😂 I agree with all of this. To the bolded, to me it's a really good reason why the average joe is willing to fight with the flagsmashers. When the world got a taste of a more equitable life and everyone working together, and then it's ripped away, I can see it.
It does make me excited for the next phase. If they don't do backstory of Donya Madani and Karli's life in this last episode, I really hope to see it in the future. Personally I hope to see more of post-blip life and reacclimation, and the public's view of superheroes now. In Civil War, public sentiment was very much about how dangerous they are, Sokovia Accords, etc. but in Far From Home, they were so willing to accept Mysterio. I gotta watch that one again.
I think in the 5 years where Nat was leading things they really revived their image as the good helpers. They were there when everything was chaos. |
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Post by pianolove on Apr 18, 2021 10:00:20 GMT -6
I agree with all of this. To the bolded, to me it's a really good reason why the average joe is willing to fight with the flagsmashers. When the world got a taste of a more equitable life and everyone working together, and then it's ripped away, I can see it.
It does make me excited for the next phase. If they don't do backstory of Donya Madani and Karli's life in this last episode, I really hope to see it in the future. Personally I hope to see more of post-blip life and reacclimation, and the public's view of superheroes now. In Civil War, public sentiment was very much about how dangerous they are, Sokovia Accords, etc. but in Far From Home, they were so willing to accept Mysterio. I gotta watch that one again.
I think in the 5 years where Nat was leading things they really revived their image as the good helpers. They were there when everything was chaos. Oh this is a good point. I forgot about endgame. Goes on the "gotta watch that one again" list too.
I was trying to picture those scenes in the beginning, remember when Rhodey said something about there being earthquakes under the sea and Namor was rumored to be in the next phase lol.
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Post by greykitty on Apr 18, 2021 10:09:17 GMT -6
pianolove, I have to watch everything again too (such a hard task). But, IIRC I think it was Okoye who mentioned the underseas earthquakes and then kind of passed it off a bit, no further investigation need at this time. The only reason I remember is there was a flurry of speculation about Wakanda and Namor entering into alliances, etc etc. Anything with Wakanda leads to interest, I think. The repeated references to White Wolf are intriguing to me as we enter the next Phase as well.
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Post by pianolove on Apr 18, 2021 10:28:04 GMT -6
pianolove , I have to watch everything again too (such a hard task). But, IIRC I think it was Okoye who mentioned the underseas earthquakes and then kind of passed it off a bit, no further investigation need at this time. The only reason I remember is there was a flurry of speculation about Wakanda and Namor entering into alliances, etc etc. Anything with Wakanda leads to interest, I think. The repeated references to White Wolf are intriguing to me as we enter the next Phase as well. ohhh yeah Rhodey was talking about Hawkeye. lol every time I think it's all coming back to me, it comes back all conflated.
And when Ayo said to lay low and basically don't come back to Wakanda for a while makes me think they have/had an ongoing relationship with Bucky. It's got to be left open for future storylines, right?? haha.
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Post by mrsnorris on Apr 19, 2021 10:40:08 GMT -6
Anyone else enjoy seeing Bucky flirt a bit with Sam’s sister? It reminded me a lot of what he’s like at the beginning of Captain America. Seeing him smile so much in this episode made me happy.
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Post by greykitty on Apr 19, 2021 10:56:28 GMT -6
I thought it was telling that neither Sam nor his sister felt the need to keep the boys from being near Bucky. Sure, I'd guess the boys didn't say 'hey, we're going to go play with the shield and wake our sleeping guest'. But if I were nervous about a guest's reactions, no matter how unintended, I'd be placing strict off-limits to my kids.
Just waking to kids playing, similar to Wakanda, might be some of the best 'medicine' there is. And knowing that Sam and his family trusted me?....even better.
And, yes, I thought even in the trailer Bucky was flirting a bit, just like pre-WW II Bucky with the ladies, and Sam's sister didn't look anything to me but pleased and interested herself.
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Lakes
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Post by Lakes on Apr 19, 2021 11:05:22 GMT -6
greykitty yes! And how calmly he woke up on the couch vs the nightmare in his apartment.
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fatpony
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Post by fatpony on Apr 20, 2021 8:31:57 GMT -6
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Apr 21, 2021 14:46:38 GMT -6
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willow
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Post by willow on Apr 21, 2021 14:55:35 GMT -6
My H and I are bummed we will be losing our Friday night show after this week. We might start either Jessica Jones or Daredevil while we wait for Loki. Agents of SHIELD doesn't really appeal to me as much.
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Post by greykitty on Apr 21, 2021 15:04:57 GMT -6
My H and I are bummed we will be losing our Friday night show after this week. We might start either Jessica Jones or Daredevil while we wait for Loki. Agents of SHIELD doesn't really appeal to me as much. Have you seen Agent Carter? It was only two seasons long. Set back after WW II. Hayley Atwell is terrific, as was the rest of the cast, IMO. |
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richard
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Post by richard on Apr 21, 2021 15:57:35 GMT -6
My H and I are bummed we will be losing our Friday night show after this week. We might start either Jessica Jones or Daredevil while we wait for Loki. Agents of SHIELD doesn't really appeal to me as much. This is what we do too. We're making Top Chef our new Friday show until Loki's on. |
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mischief
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Recap Aficionado
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Post by mischief on Apr 21, 2021 16:15:34 GMT -6
So I have managed to miss (almost) any and all spoilers for this and WandaVision. I wont lie Endgame killed my spirit, like yesterday was the first time Ive actually read MCU fic and I havent rewatched any of the movies lately even though they used to be in regular rotation. My sister keeps telliing me to watch so we can discuss. So basically my question is it worth just diving in? Im kinda guessing from thread lengths it might be, but Im afraid my love is gone and Im not really sure what to do with that.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Apr 21, 2021 16:37:34 GMT -6
So I have managed to miss (almost) any and all spoilers for this and WandaVision. I wont lie Endgame killed my spirit, like yesterday was the first time Ive actually read MCU fic and I havent rewatched any of the movies lately even though they used to be in regular rotation. My sister keeps telliing me to watch so we can discuss. So basically my question is it worth just diving in? Im kinda guessing from thread lengths it might be, but Im afraid my love is gone and Im not really sure what to do with that. So I might be biased, because my top three MCU loves are Wanda, Bucky, and Loki, in that order. But I think it is absolutely worth it. Plus we get some great Darcy Lewis and Jimmy Woo content in WandaVision. |
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willow
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Post by willow on Apr 21, 2021 16:40:45 GMT -6
So I have managed to miss (almost) any and all spoilers for this and WandaVision. I wont lie Endgame killed my spirit, like yesterday was the first time Ive actually read MCU fic and I havent rewatched any of the movies lately even though they used to be in regular rotation. My sister keeps telliing me to watch so we can discuss. So basically my question is it worth just diving in? Im kinda guessing from thread lengths it might be, but Im afraid my love is gone and Im not really sure what to do with that. Both shows are excellent in my opinion. |
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willow
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Post by willow on Apr 21, 2021 16:43:04 GMT -6
My H and I are bummed we will be losing our Friday night show after this week. We might start either Jessica Jones or Daredevil while we wait for Loki. Agents of SHIELD doesn't really appeal to me as much. Have you seen Agent Carter? It was only two seasons long. Set back after WW II. Hayley Atwell is terrific, as was the rest of the cast, IMO. I have not. I don’t really like her much though so I am not sure how into i would get. Of course I could change my opinion. |
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Post by greykitty on Apr 21, 2021 16:52:43 GMT -6
I didn't care for Peggy that much either, but the series, which I just watched last year, turned my opinion around. Also kind of helped me understand why Steve would choose that option during Endgame. I also do see that crossing arcs storyline that the writers/directors were working toward, even if it didn't match my undying Stucky devotion. LOL
I'm sure you'll find something fun/intriguing to watch til Loki pops up. I did see something that sounds like filming on Hawkeye has been completed. So much to watch going forward!
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Post by pianolove on Apr 21, 2021 17:09:59 GMT -6
So I have managed to miss (almost) any and all spoilers for this and WandaVision. I wont lie Endgame killed my spirit, like yesterday was the first time Ive actually read MCU fic and I havent rewatched any of the movies lately even though they used to be in regular rotation. My sister keeps telliing me to watch so we can discuss. So basically my question is it worth just diving in? Im kinda guessing from thread lengths it might be, but Im afraid my love is gone and Im not really sure what to do with that. I really think you’d enjoy wandavision, super well done handling Wanda and intense at times. TFATWS is just good TV, and does a great job balancing light hearted banter with heavy hitting important topics. Haha I hope I’m not overselling, I tend to get a lil overexcited. But I’m super excited you’re in this thread lol. I miss talking mcu with you! |
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Apr 21, 2021 19:02:18 GMT -6
I have not. I don’t really like her much though so I am not sure how into i would get. Of course I could change my opinion. I don't care much about Peggy but really liked the show. As far as the Netflix shows, Luke Cage was the only one I could finish. Honestly, without Kilgrave, Jessica Jones just wasn't as good. I know he's an evil bastard, but David Tennant does such a great job portraying that. He was my favorite character. |
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Post by mrsnorris on Apr 21, 2021 19:20:27 GMT -6
I don't care much about Peggy but really liked the show. As far as the Netflix shows, Luke Cage was the only one I could finish. Honestly, without Kilgrave, Jessica Jones just wasn't as good. I know he's an evil bastard, but David Tennant does such a great job portraying that. He was my favorite character. Agreed. I enjoyed the first season of JJ because of him, but barely finished the second. I don’t think I even watched the third season. |
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Cheshie6
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Post by Cheshie6 on Apr 21, 2021 20:57:06 GMT -6
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Post by greykitty on Apr 23, 2021 6:06:56 GMT -6
No order - also rushing to my first in-restaurant breakfast with a friend I haven't seen in over a year.
I like shawarma and barbecue. I love these little Avenger meals.
Wowza, Captain America! Wakanda knows how to design a suit.
Oh, Sharon. Although I did like the nifty mask and call back to Winter Soldier. And I still hope those Carter genes are playing a long game.
Karli - listen to Bucky. He knows. You played him, but you got good advice. And Karli's people seem dubious about her but a little late.
So, people did see Bucky as an Avenger I guess? Also nice motorcycle! and great arm used for good! Good work there Shuri!
Love the flying catch. I wondered how wings and the shield would work, but wonder no more.
Hi, Redwing!
Ok, actually kind of happy to see John this time. Also helps I loathe Karli.
That's right lady in chopper - follow Captain's orders. I actually applauded on my couch when she and Cap saved the day.
Sam and the truck!!!! That's right, Karli - you could have been a hero too. You wanted to be a hero in a lot of ways. That man has it right - that's Captain America!
Oh Karli. And now Cap gave you great advice. Take it, woman! You don't have the excuse of 70 years of Hydra brainwashing. That fight reminded me a bit of Steve/Bucky's fight. And I don't see what other choice Sharon really had - no matter which reason was top of her mind for saving Sam.
Sam's speeches are every bit as great as Steve's. And how handy to be globally televised. I sniffled throughout.
Who was the old guy? Zemo employee, I presume? Didn’t recognize him at first.
I like Val, LOL!
Hello, US Agent. And, honestly, will be glad to see Wyatt Russell again.
'I finished the book'.
Nice to see a young proto-Avenger. And so good to see Isaiah. That was one hell of a conversation. And yes to the exhibit! Does Sam have influence now or what?
Captain America and the Winter Soldier!!!!
Mid-credit. Damn it, Sharon!
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