dc2london
Admin
Press Secretary
Posts: 61,647 Likes: 419,536
|
Post by dc2london on Aug 7, 2020 15:17:36 GMT -6
Well. Ok. Where to begin. First, children of color are disproportionately affected by things like summer slide. Coronavirus is multiplying summer slide by 5. Children of color are more likely to have a primary caregiver who is an essential worker and literally needs school for childcare. Children of color are more likely to live in a home that can't afford to pay for outside care for children who would otherwise be in school. Children of color are more likely to be retained from grade level promotion, so while their white peers might be just fine going it at home, those kids are already at an advantage over their BIPOC peers in terms of meeting learning benchmarks required for promotion (and most of the assessments used to evaluate those skills put white children at an advantage by their very design).
|
|
tngrl3
Silver
Posts: 398 Likes: 1,567
|
Post by tngrl3 on Aug 7, 2020 15:41:15 GMT -6
dc2london said what I was struggling to put into words. With the other criteria listed in the article unfortunately a large number of POC would fit into those categories based on historical data. I honestly don't have a problem with priority for in-person learning being given to those students. Part of privilege is having the ability to do virtual school, homeschool, pods, private school, etc. I mean it is inconvenient for my household (both of us are fulltime healthcare workers) but we have resources/options and can make it work. I can't imagine the stress for families who literally have no options and limited resources to deal with things.
|
|
|
Post by ldubhawksfan on Aug 7, 2020 16:33:42 GMT -6
Well. Ok. Where to begin. First, children of color are disproportionately affected by things like summer slide. Coronavirus is multiplying summer slide by 5. Children of color are more likely to have a primary caregiver who is an essential worker and literally needs school for childcare. Children of color are more likely to live in a home that can't afford to pay for outside care for children who would otherwise be in school. Children of color are more likely to be retained from grade level promotion, so while their white peers might be just fine going it at home, those kids are already at an advantage over their BIPOC peers in terms of meeting learning benchmarks required for promotion (and most of the assessments used to evaluate those skills put white children at an advantage by their very design). Thank you for your thoughtful response. I absolutely agree that in general families of color face socioeconomic challenges, which should be factored into the prioritization of who those spots can be filled with. The fact that race outright was one of the factors is what I was struggling to put into words how to argue with my cousin. I know she will argue that there are many struggling two working parent white families. Which is why I think the point if the district’s prioritization was more to do with the socioeconomic factors, not outright race, but we cannot continue to pretend that POC are not disproportionately effected by those factors.
|
|
dc2london
Admin
Press Secretary
Posts: 61,647 Likes: 419,536
|
Post by dc2london on Aug 7, 2020 16:38:54 GMT -6
Well. Ok. Where to begin. First, children of color are disproportionately affected by things like summer slide. Coronavirus is multiplying summer slide by 5. Children of color are more likely to have a primary caregiver who is an essential worker and literally needs school for childcare. Children of color are more likely to live in a home that can't afford to pay for outside care for children who would otherwise be in school. Children of color are more likely to be retained from grade level promotion, so while their white peers might be just fine going it at home, those kids are already at an advantage over their BIPOC peers in terms of meeting learning benchmarks required for promotion (and most of the assessments used to evaluate those skills put white children at an advantage by their very design). Thank you for your thoughtful response. I absolutely agree that in general families of color face socioeconomic challenges, which should be factored into the prioritization of who those spots can be filled with. The fact that race outright was one of the factors is what I was struggling to put into words how to argue with my cousin. I know she will argue that there are many struggling two working parent white families. Which is why I think the point if the district’s prioritization was more to do with the socioeconomic factors, not outright race, but we cannot continue to pretend that POC are not disproportionately effected by those factors. There are plenty of white children living in poverty in parts of the country. This situation does not, IMO, dismiss their struggle or their need. Being in Suburban Chicago, though, I suspect this superintendent has seen first-hand how systemic racism is harming these kids. Maybe you could, say, prioritize all kids who receive free and reduced meals. Which is great. But if you don't even have the space, staff, and funding to do that, you have to look at other disadvantages. The fact is that communities of color are suffering during this pandemic unlike any other group. Yes of course, all lives matter, bit that's not what BLM is all about, ya know?
|
|
|
Post by ldubhawksfan on Aug 7, 2020 16:47:43 GMT -6
Thank you for your thoughtful response. I absolutely agree that in general families of color face socioeconomic challenges, which should be factored into the prioritization of who those spots can be filled with. The fact that race outright was one of the factors is what I was struggling to put into words how to argue with my cousin. I know she will argue that there are many struggling two working parent white families. Which is why I think the point if the district’s prioritization was more to do with the socioeconomic factors, not outright race, but we cannot continue to pretend that POC are not disproportionately effected by those factors. There are plenty of white children living in poverty in parts of the country. This situation does not, IMO, dismiss their struggle or their need. Being in Suburban Chicago, though, I suspect this superintendent has seen first-hand how systemic racism is harming these kids. Maybe you could, say, prioritize all kids who receive free and reduced meals. Which is great. But if you don't even have the space, staff, and funding to do that, you have to look at other disadvantages. The fact is that communities of color are suffering during this pandemic unlike any other group. Yes of course, all lives matter, bit that's not what BLM is all about, ya know? Absolutely. Thank you again. I made sure to edit my response to highlight the free lunches as a qualification for the prioritization as well. The whole idea that this would be an attempt for segregation, but to the detriment of white people is so eye roll worthy. And you are right, it is the ALM vs BLM Argument.
|
|
dc2london
Admin
Press Secretary
Posts: 61,647 Likes: 419,536
|
Post by dc2london on Aug 7, 2020 16:49:36 GMT -6
There are plenty of white children living in poverty in parts of the country. This situation does not, IMO, dismiss their struggle or their need. Being in Suburban Chicago, though, I suspect this superintendent has seen first-hand how systemic racism is harming these kids. Maybe you could, say, prioritize all kids who receive free and reduced meals. Which is great. But if you don't even have the space, staff, and funding to do that, you have to look at other disadvantages. The fact is that communities of color are suffering during this pandemic unlike any other group. Yes of course, all lives matter, bit that's not what BLM is all about, ya know? Absolutely. Thank you again. I made sure to edit my response to highlight the free lunches as a qualification for the prioritization as well. The whole idea that this would be an attempt for segregation, but to the detriment of white people is so eye roll worthy. And you are right, it is the ALM vs BLM Argument. I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue.
|
|
jkjacq
Ruby
Posts: 21,742 Likes: 94,334
|
Post by jkjacq on Aug 7, 2020 16:52:18 GMT -6
Absolutely. Thank you again. I made sure to edit my response to highlight the free lunches as a qualification for the prioritization as well. The whole idea that this would be an attempt for segregation, but to the detriment of white people is so eye roll worthy. And you are right, it is the ALM vs BLM Argument. I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. Where’s the meme with the fence and people standing on boxes. It’s a good visual of the equality v equity.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 17:42:31 GMT -6
My cousin (5 hours away, closest thing I’ve ever had to a sister) is having her first child after years of trying in Nov. They’re having a baby shower for her in early Oct. I haven’t been too bummed out about staying home/isolated throughout this whole thing, but this one is really bumming me out. I feel like there’s no way I’ll be able to attend and I’m just really sad tonight. Fuck covid. And Trump.
|
|
|
Post by Notarobot on Aug 7, 2020 17:44:24 GMT -6
I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. Where’s the meme with the fence and people standing on boxes. It’s a good visual of the equality v equity. I went to a webinar about equity-centered community design from an org called Creative Reaction Lab the other day based on their field guide (which was awesome and I highly recommend) and they used this visual in place of the one with the fence which I also loved: i.pinimg.com/originals/5e/38/79/5e3879993439cbcfe92b85a3fd0935c8.jpg
|
|
|
Post by Notarobot on Aug 7, 2020 17:46:29 GMT -6
I'm so sorry @ges072115, that's so tough. Fuck Covid is right.
|
|
dc2london
Admin
Press Secretary
Posts: 61,647 Likes: 419,536
|
Post by dc2london on Aug 7, 2020 17:52:53 GMT -6
Where’s the meme with the fence and people standing on boxes. It’s a good visual of the equality v equity. I went to a webinar about equity-centered community design from an org called Creative Reaction Lab the other day based on their field guide (which was awesome and I highly recommend) and they used this visual in place of the one with the fence which I also loved: i.pinimg.com/originals/5e/38/79/5e3879993439cbcfe92b85a3fd0935c8.jpgThat's excellent!
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 18:50:42 GMT -6
@idubhawksfan it also reminds me of the affirmative action argument. Maybe something else you can google for talking points.
|
|
|
Post by Uncaripswife on Aug 7, 2020 19:07:30 GMT -6
My cousin (5 hours away, closest thing I’ve ever had to a sister) is having her first child after years of trying in Nov. They’re having a baby shower for her in early Oct. I haven’t been too bummed out about staying home/isolated throughout this whole thing, but this one is really bumming me out. I feel like there’s no way I’ll be able to attend and I’m just really sad tonight. Fuck covid. And Trump. I feel you. My cousin is getting married in early October and I was really looking forward to it. Now, there is no way I'd feel comfortable going.
|
|
loony
Emerald
Posts: 12,587 Likes: 45,015
|
Post by loony on Aug 7, 2020 19:14:38 GMT -6
I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. Where’s the meme with the fence and people standing on boxes. It’s a good visual of the equality v equity. This article from my Zero Cost Textbook/Open Educational Resources course is much better. culturalorganizing.org/the-problem-with-that-equity-vs-equality-graphic/
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 20:09:38 GMT -6
Thank you for sharing this. That graphic has always felt a little off to me and now I understand why. 🎶 Learning and Growing 🎶
|
|
loony
Emerald
Posts: 12,587 Likes: 45,015
|
Post by loony on Aug 7, 2020 20:10:36 GMT -6
Thank you for sharing this. That graphic has always felt a little off to me and now I understand why. 🎶 Learning and Growing 🎶 Just have to tear down the fucking wall all together.
|
|
|
Post by ldubhawksfan on Aug 7, 2020 21:23:46 GMT -6
Absolutely. Thank you again. I made sure to edit my response to highlight the free lunches as a qualification for the prioritization as well. The whole idea that this would be an attempt for segregation, but to the detriment of white people is so eye roll worthy. And you are right, it is the ALM vs BLM Argument. I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. Ooof, her response is pretty shitty including saying that racism isn’t real. I don’t have the energy to respond tonight, especially after a shocking TK parent meeting tonight. I’m so disappointed in her.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2020 21:28:54 GMT -6
I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. Ooof, her response is pretty shitty including saying that racism isn’t real. I don’t have the energy to respond tonight, especially after a shocking TK parent meeting tonight. I’m so disappointed in her. I’m sorry. Being disappointed by people you care about sucks. At this point if someone thinks racism is not real... I call that willful ignorance and walk away. That’s not the best approach for everyone, but my precious energy is better used elsewhere, IMO.
|
|
|
Post by blurnette989 on Aug 8, 2020 1:59:34 GMT -6
I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. Ooof, her response is pretty shitty including saying that racism isn’t real. I don’t have the energy to respond tonight, especially after a shocking TK parent meeting tonight. I’m so disappointed in her. I will say that I think it's important to respond in these situations. Not to argue but literally to express your disappointment. People won't change if they think everyone likes their positions. "I'm really saddened by your response. The wholesale denial of the existence of racism feels cruel and disingenuous. I'm going to disengage from this conversation because I don't think it will be productive. I hope you will reconsider your position. "
|
|
|
Post by ldubhawksfan on Aug 8, 2020 9:18:00 GMT -6
Ooof, her response is pretty shitty including saying that racism isn’t real. I don’t have the energy to respond tonight, especially after a shocking TK parent meeting tonight. I’m so disappointed in her. I will say that I think it's important to respond in these situations. Not to argue but literally to express your disappointment. People won't change if they think everyone likes their positions. "I'm really saddened by your response. The wholesale denial of the existence of racism feels cruel and disingenuous. I'm going to disengage from this conversation because I don't think it will be productive. I hope you will reconsider your position. " Thank you! I used much of your wording in my response. I’m still feeling really upset about her comments. I knew that my AZ cousins In question were R Trump supporters, but fuck to “hear” her outright say racism as being discussed lately isn’t real, and in fact this policy is basically segregation solely for the benefit of POC (as in a TERRIBLE thing) is just so shocking.
|
|
koko
Silver
Posts: 273 Likes: 999
|
Post by koko on Aug 8, 2020 10:35:57 GMT -6
Tell me how to feel about this? My nurse friends are sharing a lot this am
|
|
lion
Bronze
Posts: 216 Likes: 1,041
|
Post by lion on Aug 8, 2020 10:54:19 GMT -6
Tell me how to feel about this? My nurse friends are sharing a lot this am While the sentiment is admirable, it's not at all the same. And for all the "proud to be at work," there's at least as many who STILL have not had a break to grieve the losses they've suffered. It's dangerously close to hero worship, where you rah rah the troops so no one has to think about how needless the deaths are. There will be deaths, there's no getting around it. The essential medical workers who died sure as hell aren't celebrating how worthy they feel, and I'm guessing their co-workers aren't either. It's possible to be supportive without trying to down play the seriousness of the situation. This isn't it.
|
|
jkjacq
Ruby
Posts: 21,742 Likes: 94,334
|
Post by jkjacq on Aug 8, 2020 10:56:21 GMT -6
Tell me how to feel about this? My nurse friends are sharing a lot this am Fatalistic view? My bff is a nurse. She’s not working with Covid patients but some of her coworkers have been sick. She takes precautions etc but she said to me the other day it’s now not a matter of if I get it but when. I think it’s not saying get back in the classrooms but more like we know how terrifying it is. I could be wrong.
|
|
athn64
Ruby
Posts: 17,412 Likes: 76,727
|
Post by athn64 on Aug 8, 2020 11:02:40 GMT -6
Tell me how to feel about this? My nurse friends are sharing a lot this am A healthcare worker dealing with exposure with patients in the middle of a pandemic is not comparable to teachers being forced back into the classroom. Teachers aren't supposed to have to deal with sickness on that level. And they did not sign up for it in the way a nurse did.
|
|
starbuck
Emerald
Posts: 12,464 Likes: 81,139
|
Post by starbuck on Aug 8, 2020 11:21:18 GMT -6
Absolutely. Thank you again. I made sure to edit my response to highlight the free lunches as a qualification for the prioritization as well. The whole idea that this would be an attempt for segregation, but to the detriment of white people is so eye roll worthy. And you are right, it is the ALM vs BLM Argument. I have thought over and over about how you could equitably bring back the children who most need it but there's no easy answer. And no solution is "fair." Because equity =\= equality. Plus, no matter what you do, someone will sue. In case anyone finds them useful, here are a few good equity v equality images that illustrate the difference between equity and equality in a way even Karens *should* be able to understand. I like the second because the final image removes the barrier that creates the problem. www.diffen.com/difference/Image:Inclusion.jpgwww.diffen.com/difference/Image:Equality-equity-justice-lores.png
|
|
starbuck
Emerald
Posts: 12,464 Likes: 81,139
|
Post by starbuck on Aug 8, 2020 11:22:35 GMT -6
Lol i see easier beat me to the images!
|
|
cnf
Ruby
Posts: 20,921 Likes: 100,985
|
Post by cnf on Aug 8, 2020 12:11:12 GMT -6
Tell me how to feel about this? My nurse friends are sharing a lot this am A healthcare worker dealing with exposure with patients in the middle of a pandemic is not comparable to teachers being forced back into the classroom. Teachers aren't supposed to have to deal with sickness on that level. And they did not sign up for it in the way a nurse did. This. Agreed. If you sign up to be a nurse you know you're putting yourself at risk of sickness and disease. Your job has built in safety measures, procautions, policies, on how to handle these things while keeping you safe. Teachers do not sign up for disease exposure beyond the sniffles or the flu at worst, and even that's not really part of anything. We are not frontline workers for the sick. And now our jobs are trying their damnedest to figure out how to add in things to make use a makeshift frontline worker. It's not what we signed up for, it sucks and it's scary.
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2020 12:44:17 GMT -6
Lol i see easier beat me to the images! ‘Twas others, I’m just liking and expressing appreciation! 🤗
|
|
cnf
Ruby
Posts: 20,921 Likes: 100,985
|
Post by cnf on Aug 8, 2020 14:03:38 GMT -6
|
|
dc2london
Admin
Press Secretary
Posts: 61,647 Likes: 419,536
|
Post by dc2london on Aug 8, 2020 14:12:03 GMT -6
I see a lot of COVID survivors really worried about this because CFS is sort of nebulous and not really taken seriously/treated, and this is actually a type of encephalitis (I think) that is historically not really studied or given much attention
|
|