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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 10:24:23 GMT -6
Two things got me through the rough bit last night.
1) I remembered how good it felt after when it worked. The crying sucks and you second guess yourself and I hate myself and I can’t believe I’m such a horrible mother - until everyone is sleeping and happier and it reminds me how important it really is to sleep well and how hard it is to learn.
2) My friend IRL told me that it’s way meaner to the baby to start and let them cry, and then give in half way because then you’ve made them cry for no reason. Like it was easier for her to let her baby cry because there was a purpose. If you give up half way in, then you let them cry with no reason. I seriously have to repeat this to myself all the time because I had completely convinced myself to go back in and feed him last night.
*this might not be helpful to anyone else but damn it resonated with me and I think about it all the time.
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 10:25:11 GMT -6
Oh hi. I could talk about my sleep training feelings all day long. I’m really not kidding when I say I have PTSD from DS1 and his non sleeping nonsense.
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Post by dizzycooks on Sept 11, 2018 10:26:20 GMT -6
We are trying some very light sleep training. Dh goes in and the. Again after 5 minutes. It works about half the time. I’m not ready for full blown cio. I have taken the paci away at the Y and during other childcare situations. I can’t quite do it over night...we need to though.
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snowmoon
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Post by snowmoon on Sept 11, 2018 10:27:59 GMT -6
Oh hi. I could talk about my sleep training feelings all day long. I’m really not kidding when I say I have PTSD from DS1 and his non sleeping nonsense. Glad I'm not the only one. |
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Post by dizzycooks on Sept 11, 2018 10:29:59 GMT -6
We are doing rice cereal with different mashed fruit/veggies. He’s finally Liking it.
I am definitely operating at 1/2 my usual capacity due to sleep, but I am also trying desperately to get a little business going on the real estate side of things. It’s so hard to find balance. I just found out all of my shifts at my other job were cancel due to low attendance so that sucks. I need a break from the kids and I need to make a little $.
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snowmoon
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Post by snowmoon on Sept 11, 2018 10:31:44 GMT -6
I don't want to let her cio but we have to do something. Ds was so hard. We tried to night wean when he was like 15 months and so would lay beside him while he cried because he wanted to nurse. My dad literally sat beside me and told me I was torturing him. It was awful and unfair and I let it get to me.
I worked a few overnights of the week and never slept at work and he nursed at least once overnight until he was like 2. I can't do it again.
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Post by stardust84 on Sept 11, 2018 10:32:03 GMT -6
Well we were up a lot last night but L slept past 6. I don't know what to do about the night feedings. He nurses a lot during the day (I offer and he refuses) but he still wants a lot at night. If he won't take it during the day I can't increase what he takes in. I have been weighing him on our home scale and he doesn't seem to be gaining anything but is happy and content. I am thinking of sticking to feeding every 3 hours s or more at least until his 6 month check up in two weeks.
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 10:32:39 GMT -6
We are doing rice cereal with different mashed fruit/veggies. He’s finally Liking it. I am definitely operating at 1/2 my usual capacity due to sleep, but I am also trying desperately to get a little business going on the real estate side of things. It’s so hard to find balance. I just found out all of my shifts at my other job were cancel due to low attendance so that sucks. I need a break from the kids and I need to make a little $. Good luck on the side business! I hope it works out and you get $$  |
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snowmoon
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Post by snowmoon on Sept 11, 2018 10:33:52 GMT -6
Daytime sleep is going well though! So that's something. Not sure why she won't let me put her down at night.
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 10:35:26 GMT -6
I don't want to let her cio but we have to do something. Ds was so hard. We tried to night wean when he was like 15 months and so would lay beside him while he cried because he wanted to nurse. My dad literally sat beside me and told me I was torturing him. It was awful and unfair and I let it get to me. I worked a few overnights of the week and never slept at work and he nursed at least once overnight until he was like 2. I can't do it again. That was really unfair of your dad to say that to you. Anyone would let that get to them. I hope whatever you decide to do, it works. I don’t blame you about not being able to do it again. That sounds like torture to you. |
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 10:40:10 GMT -6
Just for the record, I know CIO isn’t the be all end all for everyone. Babies are hard man. Parenting is hard.
I actually tried not to do CIO this time around by trying to do all the other things you’re supposed to do and we still ended up with a crying baby last night for an hour. Babies are hard.
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Post by alwayscheese on Sept 11, 2018 10:41:21 GMT -6
Thanks leatherpants! DH and I had decided whether we would do extinction or check and console but I totally forget what DH wanted to do. I don't care as long as DH is on board. And today I'm gonna nurse him plenty(not try to push him off a few minutes because it hasn't been 2 hours yet) so hopefully he gets all the milk he needs during the day. |
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Post by alwayscheese on Sept 11, 2018 10:52:30 GMT -6
clementine mentioned CIO for wake ups in the first 5 hours. Is this the general rule? His bedtime is 7 and I'd rather feed him at 9 or ten than 3 or 4.
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whatsit
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Post by whatsit on Sept 11, 2018 11:42:38 GMT -6
A decided to have her first wake up at 5 the last 2 nights so I’m hoping this will become a new norm for a while *knock on wood* 2-3 hours between wake ups does not work.
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Post by clementine on Sept 11, 2018 11:55:56 GMT -6
That makes sense nevertoomanyshoes. Solids are pretty inconsistent right now, but on weeknights solids are between the 6:30 nursing right when we get home and 8:00 bedtime nursing. He hardly eats any at all though. He’ll take 5-10 spoonfuls or purée then refuse or chow down on some soft solids but seems to actually swallow very little. I’m guessing as he eats more solids, we’ll cut out one evening nursing. Thanks for all the info leatherpants. You can TL;DR all you want about sleep training and night weaning... I definitely will read. I’m wondering if we need to cut out an evening feed now. Like I said, he nurses right when we get home at 6:30 and he’s ready for bed around 8, so I was trying to nurse at bedtime so he could have another feed before he goes to bed to give him the extra calories and hopefully lengthen the first stretch of sleep. He doesn’t take much by bottle at daycare. I nurse at lunch, but otherwise he averages 6-8 oz by bottle over an 11 hour period. At bedtime, he nurses then there’s about a 5-10 min window of sleep sack, book, song before he goes in his crib. He sometimes takes the pacifier to bed. If he does, he usually falls asleep quickly. If not, we have to go in a couple times to soothe him before he falls asleep. Maybe that’s not enough time between nursing and bedtime. But if I try to lengthen that time, that either means I nurse earlier (but he probably wouldn’t be hungry because he just nursed at 6:30, plus when would we do solids?) or put him to bed later (but I don’t want to keep him up if he’s tired). Idk. I’m hesitant to reduce/cut out night feeds because I’m not sure he gets enough during the day at daycare. They offer every 2-3 hours, but he just hardly eats there. That’s a whole other issue. Although when I’m home F-Sun, he nurses well every 2-3 hours and still wakes up to nurse twice overnight. |
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Post by clementine on Sept 11, 2018 12:05:17 GMT -6
clementine mentioned CIO for wake ups in the first 5 hours. Is this the general rule? His bedtime is 7 and I'd rather feed him at 9 or ten than 3 or 4. That’s just what I remember reading in the PLS book. I think it said you can decide the number of hours after bedtime that you ignore wake ups, but 5 seemed to work for most people? But that rule doesn’t necessarily apply to babies who are still eating MOTN. I could be wrong on this. Maybe our PLS gurus leatherpants and @katetopaz can explain better. |
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Post by clementine on Sept 11, 2018 12:08:54 GMT -6
How do you know if he’s waking and eating out of habit or if he’s really hungry? I know sometimes he’ll just be comfort nursing and then that’s an indication he doesn’t really need to eat and I could have tried to let him soothe himself. But if he does nurse a decent amount, I’m assuming that he’s actually hungry. But could that be habit? Is this a stupid question?
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Post by alwayscheese on Sept 11, 2018 12:31:20 GMT -6
How do you know if he’s waking and eating out of habit or if he’s really hungry? I know sometimes he’ll just be comfort nursing and then that’s an indication he doesn’t really need to eat and I could have tried to let him soothe himself. But if he does nurse a decent amount, I’m assuming that he’s actually hungry. But could that be habit? Is this a stupid question? Did you read my mind |
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 12:43:05 GMT -6
clementine mentioned CIO for wake ups in the first 5 hours. Is this the general rule? His bedtime is 7 and I'd rather feed him at 9 or ten than 3 or 4. She does say in the PLS book to pick one feed to start and it makes sense to pick that 2/3am feed to start on so that you get a long uninterrupted stretch. And if he’s actually hungry at that time, start by gradually reducing the length of time you feed. So if it’s 10 mins, pop baby off at 9 for night one and the idea is that by the time you get to 2-3 mins they will not need it anymore and if they wake you can send in either non boob Dad or do some cuddling or let them fuss for 10 mins and go back to sleep |
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 12:45:28 GMT -6
I also worry about the intake during the day because he eats a lot at night and his daytime feeds are distracted AF. And he’s had some growing issues so I get really anxious about it. But my plan is to just keep offering during the day and work on eliminating one night feed at a time. I need him to learn we eat during the day and sleep at night. I don’t know though. Best laid plans and all that. But that’s the plan I’m currently operating on. 🤞🏻
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 12:53:25 GMT -6
How do you know if he’s waking and eating out of habit or if he’s really hungry? I know sometimes he’ll just be comfort nursing and then that’s an indication he doesn’t really need to eat and I could have tried to let him soothe himself. But if he does nurse a decent amount, I’m assuming that he’s actually hungry. But could that be habit? Is this a stupid question? Not a stupid question. I swear I read this in the book last night (which is why I’m sounding like a knownit all and it’s making me cringe. I just literally read it last night so it’s fresh.) I think that’s where the 3 hour rule comes in. If he can go 3 or 4 hours during the day, you know he can do that at night. And their biggest stretch of sleep is usually from bedtime to first wake up. So that’s where the not before midnight rule comes in. But I know she also was really clear that you probably know best so Work from that. And that hunger and habit are kind of intertwined. Like if you ate 6 times a night, you start waking up being hungry at those times. And there was something about cheeseburgers. I remember that in the book |
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Post by clementine on Sept 11, 2018 12:56:14 GMT -6
Lol cheeseburgers. I remember her mentioning that too. Clearly I need to go back and re-read.
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 13:00:02 GMT -6
clementine, I think Alexis would say that you probably have to work on the falling asleep without the suck association first - like no pacifier at bedtime before working on night weaning. Because then you know he can go to sleep on his own. Otherwise then I think you think you are working on a night feed thing and actually it’s a sleep association thing. I don’t know. I’m just guessing what she might say. I run into the same timing problem with feeds at night. Like he needs to eat at say 530 and he goes to sleep at 7 so do I feed him at 630 too? What I’ve found is that B will wake up roughly at the same time regardless. Like if I feed at 530 or 630, he’s still waking up at 10 to eat next. I don’t think there is any harm in trying something and see what happens. Like try not nursing him again right before bed to break that association. The worst that will happen is a nightmare bedtime (which is sucky) but then you know it’s an association thing. Or he wakes up earlier to eat and you’d know he was hungry vs habit. Right? I’m just spitballing.
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 13:01:33 GMT -6
Fuck you guys. I hate sounding like a know it all. You’ve just really hit me where all my focus is right now and I’m laughing because I act like I know what I’m talking about but really I’m just parroting what I read last night. I might still be up 80 times tonight.
Feel free to tell me to stuff it too.
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Leaf 🌱
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Post by Leaf 🌱 on Sept 11, 2018 14:48:40 GMT -6
Fuck you guys. I hate sounding like a know it all. You’ve just really hit me where all my focus is right now and I’m laughing because I act like I know what I’m talking about but really I’m just parroting what I read last night. I might still be up 80 times tonight. Feel free to tell me to stuff it too. I feel like sleep, poop, eating habits, etc can only really be discussed with people who are experiencing the same thing or also have PTSD from a bad experience. No one else really understands or cares... or else they just want to give you shitty advice about “when they had kids” or “back in their day.” 🙄🙄🙄 DD1 was the world’s worst sleeer and DD2 is the best (KNOCK ON ALL THE WOOD) and I didn’t do a damn thing differently. I’m firmly in the “do what works best for your family” camp too and I commend you for giving a lot of great advice without ever sounding preachy or judgemental. |
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Post by clementine on Sept 11, 2018 14:57:19 GMT -6
Fuck you guys. I hate sounding like a know it all. You’ve just really hit me where all my focus is right now and I’m laughing because I act like I know what I’m talking about but really I’m just parroting what I read last night. I might still be up 80 times tonight. Feel free to tell me to stuff it too. I appreciate your spitballing! I don’t even care if you’re right or wrong, it helps to have a sounding board to tell me if what I’m thinking makes sense or if I’m way off. |
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Post by nevertoomanyshoes on Sept 11, 2018 15:16:07 GMT -6
Haha leatherpants, I read that as Fuck You, guys for a second and was like woah that really escalated quickly lol. But seriously you know my first child sleep life. The PTSD is real. I can never do that again. |
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 15:17:45 GMT -6
Haha leatherpants, I read that as Fuck You, guys for a second and was like woah that really escalated quickly lol. But seriously you know my first child sleep life. The PTSD is real. I can never do that again. Lol. Why commas are important. Or not using Fuck as a vocabulary seasoning. But I like it. |
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Post by nevertoomanyshoes on Sept 11, 2018 15:25:18 GMT -6
At the moment DS2 is going to bed at like 5pm because his naps are shit. But the past few nights he’s been waking at 8 so H tries to settle him but it seems he’s actually hungry as he has a big feed when we tag. This suits me better than him feeding at 10 or 11 after I’ve been in bed for an hour or two so for now I’m letting it go.
A big part of DS1’s sleep problem was not feeding enough during the day (too distracted). The other big part was sleep associations. Getting him to fall asleep on his own in the crib (with me sitting there soothing him) was the first big break through. Then he started sleeping three hours at a time at night instead of 45 minutes. With him, I used pick up put down method as CIO wasn’t something I could commit properly to (no judgment, I just knew I or H would cave and it would be pointless).
This one isn’t responding as well to pick up put down, (just gets too worked up) but he is soothing a bit with his thumb and sometimes putting himself to sleep when I put him down drowsy.
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Post by leatherpants on Sept 11, 2018 19:15:44 GMT -6
You wanna know what is making me crazy these days? The vomit. B still spits up - a lot - after every single feed (except night feeds of course). Both of us smell like barf all. The. Time. If he’s playing on the floor, he’ll throw up and then roll in it. Everything smells. My house feels like it’s covered in a layer of baby barf and dog hair. I change clothes at least 3 times a day and sometimes I just don’t because what’s the point.
This will be the end of me. I swear it.
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