dc2london
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Post by dc2london on May 1, 2020 13:18:56 GMT -6
Punker that probably sounded really argumentative, and that wasn't my intent. I'm sorry. I'm mad at and about a lot of things today but you are not one of them lol
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Post by KnightRyder on May 1, 2020 13:25:07 GMT -6
I feel like an asshole because I want to support all women touched by assault but I also have to be pragmatic about this election. I don't want to give him a pass, and I don't want to hand things to Trump because holy shit at everything happening in the world and within our own country right now. Everything Sucks. 2020 motto. Personally I don’t feel like an asshole (I don’t mean to invalidate your feelings in any way). Maybe he’s lying, maybe she is, I won’t know without a doubt. I generally believe women. In another election in another world I might cast a protest third party vote, but not now. The stakes are too high. It’s devastating how low the bar is now but it’s our ugly reality. And, I hope, the beginning of better days.
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AmyG
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Post by AmyG on May 1, 2020 13:53:34 GMT -6
Since in politics as it is in life, everyone lies Dr. Who lies and Dr House says everyone lies
I'm going with she is lying and Biden is lying and we know trump is lying and and and and they all lie for some aim
yes I think she is lying in some manner about what happened, did he touch her inappropriately? probably. Most women it seems have been touched inappropriately by a man in their lifetimes...she says she reported it, which would be an anomaly for the time period, but nobody has found the record, and nobody remembers her reporting it. Maybe she's lying for why she's bringing it up now. Why not at some other time in Biden's 30+ years of public service, including when he was vice president? And the conspiracy theory part of my brain asks what if she's a Trump supporter lying about details and keeping it up in the press so Trump will win?
yes I think Biden is lying in some manner about his relationship with this lady, he may have touched her inappropriately but never paid attention, cause 30 years ago we were in a different place on how that stuff all worked/reported/society treated it/teaching men not to touch etc etc. He was the product of the time and he seems to have tried hard to grow and learn. He's failed at it tho and he's probably lied about his failures and refused to admit them. Trump only lies and for his own self serving interests so that's what we are up against. He's a bad bad man who can't win this thing. no way, no how.
I will say the horrible part out loud. Even if it's true, I don't care. Biden is a better man for president than Trump any day.
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sctiger
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Post by sctiger on May 1, 2020 14:05:13 GMT -6
Our choices are between Biden and Trump. Biden is the nominee and that's not going to change. 4 more years of Trump would bring more corruption, horrendous court appointments, abhorrent immigration policy, dangerous policies for women and other minority groups, declining health care policies, I could go on. Trump is a fucking disaster. I'm not about to put other people's lives at risk for one accusation.
I hate, hate saying this but I do question the credibility of the accusation. Look into it, sure, but why is this coming up now? He was thoroughly vetted by Obama and nothing came up. Why not bring this up a year ago when Biden launched his campaign? Her story has changed and there are journalists who didn't pick up the story. She says she is voting for Biden, so obviously she wants him to win, so why speak out and interfere with his chances? Predators often repeat and there are no other accusers. I also wouldn't rule out that this is being used to hurt the Democrats. Who knows. These are not normal times Maybe I'm blinded but that's how I feel.
Let's say this did happen. It's him or Trump and Biden wins every time regardless. He's not perfect but he's been a good leader for a long time. We don't have to agree with every vote or position because what you believed in, say 2001, is different from how you feel and act in 2020. Biden has done a lot to improve policies for women and we can't forget that. Biden will have a woman VP, he will have a top notch Cabinet, court nominees, etc. We will be better off with a Biden administration. Our country will be in shambles if we have more Trump and Republican rule.
In this election, in these times, winning is everything. We can't let Trump and the Republicans win. This is not a time to necessarily take the high road and expect perfection. Even if this hurts, we have to get Trump out. Period.
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Post by summerbabe on May 1, 2020 14:07:27 GMT -6
I keep typing and deleting, but basically I think that this is reason number 394034903 that Biden's VP choice needs to be incredibly solid.
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claudia
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Post by claudia on May 1, 2020 14:09:25 GMT -6
Since in politics as it is in life, everyone lies Dr. Who lies and Dr House says everyone lies I'm going with she is lying and Biden is lying and we know trump is lying and and and and they all lie for some aim yes I think she is lying in some manner about what happened, did he touch her inappropriately? probably. Most women it seems have been touched inappropriately by a man in their lifetimes...she says she reported it, which would be an anomaly for the time period, but nobody has found the record, and nobody remembers her reporting it. Maybe she's lying for why she's bringing it up now. Why not at some other time in Biden's 30+ years of public service, including when he was vice president? And the conspiracy theory part of my brain asks what if she's a Trump supporter lying about details and keeping it up in the press so Trump will win? yes I think Biden is lying in some manner about his relationship with this lady, he may have touched her inappropriately but never paid attention, cause 30 years ago we were in a different place on how that stuff all worked/reported/society treated it/teaching men not to touch etc etc. He was the product of the time and he seems to have tried hard to grow and learn. He's failed at it tho and he's probably lied about his failures and refused to admit them. Trump only lies and for his own self serving interests so that's what we are up against. He's a bad bad man who can't win this thing. no way, no how. I will say the horrible part out loud. Even if it's true, I don't care. Biden is a better man for president than Trump any day. I keep seeing crap like the bolded, and it makes me furious. Sorry, AmyG, but it's true. You're going to act like there hasn't been a movement the last few years to support women into speaking up FINALLY? That is one of the exact arguments that was made against Dr. Ford in the Kavanaugh hearings. Women didn't speak up before because they didn't have support. The rest of your post can still be 100% true without arguing that the timing of when she spoke up invalidates her claims. Biden can still be better than Trump obviously. You can still think there are reasons not to trust her. But I'm not going to keep playing the "why didn't she speak up sooner" argument. Look at how she's being treated now - now in a time when there has been a concerted message to trust women. And you wonder why she didn't speak up 12 years ago when there wasn't a strong message like that and he was nominated for vice-president?
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Post by coconutbacon on May 1, 2020 14:28:28 GMT -6
I keep typing and deleting, but basically I think that this is reason number 394034903 that Biden's VP choice needs to be incredibly solid. Yes.
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dc2london
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Post by dc2london on May 1, 2020 14:47:20 GMT -6
I do think there's a difference between this situation and Kavanaugh because Kavanaugh was one of a long list of candidates the administration was considering. That's not me saying Ms Reade should have spoken up earlier in the primary, because no victim needs to operate on anyone else's timeline. I'm saying this would have influenced my primary vote.
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Post by cakewench on May 1, 2020 14:53:59 GMT -6
Hey guys, Trump's allegations don't matter because he was elected.
Please excuse me while I go vomit. And then throw things.
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stepho
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Post by stepho on May 1, 2020 14:56:51 GMT -6
I keep typing and deleting, but basically I think that this is reason number 394034903 that Biden's VP choice needs to be incredibly solid. I feel like it needs to be Harris. I'm a big Klobuchar fan. I've voted for her several times as my senator, and I've been happy with her work in the senate. I'd love to see her tapped as the VP pick. That being said, I don't trust my fellow Minnesotans to replace her with another democrat. We can't lose footing in the senate. I like Kamala. I have a great deal of respect for her. AND I have more faith in California to vote in another democrat than I do my home state.
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jaygee
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Post by jaygee on May 1, 2020 15:16:23 GMT -6
I keep typing and deleting, but basically I think that this is reason number 394034903 that Biden's VP choice needs to be incredibly solid. I feel like it needs to be Harris. I'm a big Klobuchar fan. I've voted for her several times as my senator, and I've been happy with her work in the senate. I'd love to see her tapped as the VP pick. That being said, I don't trust my fellow Minnesotans to replace her with another democrat. We can't lose footing in the senate. I like Kamala. I have a great deal of respect for her. AND I have more faith in California to vote in another democrat than I do my home state. This is funny because Senator Harris is mine and I am hoping for Klobuchar to be the VP pick. I want to keep my Senator since she wasn’t the presidential nom. I also think Klobuchar helps him more in the electorate. But you are right that CA will vote in another Dem if she is the pick.
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Post by summerbabe on May 1, 2020 15:17:14 GMT -6
I keep typing and deleting, but basically I think that this is reason number 394034903 that Biden's VP choice needs to be incredibly solid. I feel like it needs to be Harris. I'm a big Klobuchar fan. I've voted for her several times as my senator, and I've been happy with her work in the senate. I'd love to see her tapped as the VP pick. That being said, I don't trust my fellow Minnesotans to replace her with another democrat. We can't lose footing in the senate. I like Kamala. I have a great deal of respect for her. AND I have more faith in California to vote in another democrat than I do my home state. She would do *such* a good job.
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Post by KnightRyder on May 1, 2020 15:22:02 GMT -6
I’m all in on Stacey. I know there are excellent choices and valid reasons she shouldn’t be it, but I love her and she checks many boxes. I saw her speak and she sealed the deal for me (as if I have any say).
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jkjacq
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Post by jkjacq on May 1, 2020 15:35:18 GMT -6
Hey guys, Trump's allegations don't matter because he was elected. Please excuse me while I go vomit. And then throw things. Wait she held an actual briefing? I’m hiding from most news nowadays but holy shit
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Post by punker1212 on May 1, 2020 17:52:39 GMT -6
dc2london no worries! I know what you mean. I think 2016 taught us the dangers of getting too comfortable with polling numbers, and I worry a lot about voter suppression attempts from this administration and or republican governors. I also worry this pushes people who would have “held their noses” to vote Biden to not bother. Who wants to vote for sexual predators? People who are being that principled in their voting.... likely not. Just in general (not @ you or anyone in particular dc) I am incredibly disturbed by the ease with which so many Democrats are willing to dismiss this woman. It is markedly hypocritical, certainly dissolves our moral high ground and makes coming forward that much harder for other women. I feel like this dismissive ness sets back a lot if not most of the ground we have made. And I am especially upset by Whitmer’s response, a character evaluation that the joe Biden she knows wouldn’t do something like that. Ummmmm except that we know people who prey on women gain positions of power and credibility. This is 101 here. I don’t like the democratic response.
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dc2london
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Post by dc2london on May 1, 2020 18:03:31 GMT -6
Whitmer’s response, a character evaluation that the joe Biden she knows wouldn’t do something like that. Yiiiiikes
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Post by cakewench on May 3, 2020 9:28:24 GMT -6
New poll shows most want Liz as Biden’s VP pick, followed by Kamala and Stacey.
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jkjacq
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Post by jkjacq on May 3, 2020 9:33:02 GMT -6
I know the convention isn’t until later this year and Biden is still the presumptive nominee But
I wish he’d just name his VP pick. I don’t have mental capacity to a be super excited for him and b the seeming auditions going on.
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jaygee
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Post by jaygee on May 3, 2020 9:37:04 GMT -6
I know the convention isn’t until later this year and Biden is still the presumptive nominee But I wish he’d just name his VP pick. I don’t have mental capacity to a be super excited for him and b the seeming auditions going on. This is my wish every single day. He needs to announce his pick so everyone can stop speculating and so that person can get out there and message on things he’s not as strong on. That being said, it makes me sick to my stomach that whatever woman he selects will have to answer questions about the allegations. Shit always runs down.
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jaygee
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Post by jaygee on May 3, 2020 9:38:14 GMT -6
I’m not going to lie - I think the age factor makes Senator Warren a non starter for me as VP. It’s just not strategic.
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jkjacq
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Post by jkjacq on May 3, 2020 9:54:38 GMT -6
I’m not going to lie - I think the age factor makes Senator Warren a non starter for me as VP. It’s just not strategic. I feel like that some days as well. Then I think how hard she fights against corporate interest and flip again. I don’t think about the age thing with Kamala but damn she’s just so good and a vp position may limit her ability to write good laws Then I’m like I’d really like liz and Kamala to stay in the senate and continue to do what they do. Both of them could be so effective with a dem led senate as much as I love Stacey Abrams I think does she have the foreign policy chops we’re gonna need to repair our relationships abroad AGAIN ? This is why I need them to get it over with.
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Post by lemondrop on May 3, 2020 11:18:51 GMT -6
Voting is 6 months from today. It seems like a lifetime away with all the shit this administration does.
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sctiger
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Post by sctiger on May 3, 2020 11:28:15 GMT -6
I wonder if he will pick someone who isn't quite as well known. I've heard talk about Catherine Cortez Masto from Nevada. She covers a different area of the country and is one of the top Latina politicians. I think she could be a good pick.
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jaygee
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Post by jaygee on May 3, 2020 12:48:59 GMT -6
I wonder if he will pick someone who isn't quite as well known. I've heard talk about Catherine Cortez Masto from Nevada. She covers a different area of the country and is one of the top Latina politicians. I think she could be a good pick. If I had betting money it would be someone not on the speculation list. I also this Cortez Masto is an excellent and strategic choice. Oh the “list” the only one I see him picking is Klobuchar.
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sctiger
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Post by sctiger on May 3, 2020 13:48:10 GMT -6
I'd also like to see Warren and Harris in Senate leadership roles, especially if we take the Senate. I feel like they could make some major progress within the Senate if given the opportunity.
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claudia
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Post by claudia on May 3, 2020 14:00:18 GMT -6
I think he was nominated as the “safe” choice and I expect his vp choice to be equally safe. For that reason, I think it will be Klobuchar or something other moderate white woman.
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Post by hawkeye2015 on May 3, 2020 15:03:36 GMT -6
I wonder if he will pick someone who isn't quite as well known. I've heard talk about Catherine Cortez Masto from Nevada. She covers a different area of the country and is one of the top Latina politicians. I think she could be a good pick. If I had betting money it would be someone not on the speculation list. I also this Cortez Masto is an excellent and strategic choice. Oh the “list” the only one I see him picking is Klobuchar. I've also heard people float Michelle Lujan Grisham and Tammy Duckworth. I think they would both be great choices.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on May 3, 2020 15:15:17 GMT -6
If I had betting money it would be someone not on the speculation list. I also this Cortez Masto is an excellent and strategic choice. Oh the “list” the only one I see him picking is Klobuchar. I've also heard people float Michelle Lujan Grisham and Tammy Duckworth. I think they would both be great choices. Don't take Tammy from us! We need her.
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Post by punker1212 on May 3, 2020 19:23:57 GMT -6
I’m not going to lie - I think the age factor makes Senator Warren a non starter for me as VP. It’s just not strategic. I feel like that some days as well. Then I think how hard she fights against corporate interest and flip again. I don’t think about the age thing with Kamala but damn she’s just so good and a vp position may limit her ability to write good laws Then I’m like I’d really like liz and Kamala to stay in the senate and continue to do what they do. Both of them could be so effective with a dem led senate as much as I love Stacey Abrams I think does she have the foreign policy chops we’re gonna need to repair our relationships abroad AGAIN ? This is why I need them to get it over with. Oh hello ticker running inside my head all day!
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Post by punker1212 on May 3, 2020 19:26:20 GMT -6
New poll shows most want Liz as Biden’s VP pick, followed by Kamala and Stacey. I could be very pumped about the first three in this list and shrugs about the rest.
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