mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 3, 2019 15:26:33 GMT -6
This thread has been renamed. Please join us in our spiral. But also lets watch Shadowhunters together. Anyone watched this? Its based on the Mortal Instruments books series but from what I understand it differs greatly from the books especially season 3, that is currently airing. Its in its final season and is getting a 2 hour finale this Spring. It looks right up my ally. On her birthday, Clary Fray discovers a surprise concerning her life. The teenager is not who she thinks she is -- she comes from a long line of human-angel hybrids, called Shadowhunters, who hunt demons. After her mother is kidnapped, Clary is thrust into the world of demon-hunting. Clary relies on mysterious Jace and fellow hunters Isabelle and Alec to help her navigate the dark world. While living in this new world among creatures like vampires and werewolves, Clary's best friend Simon helps her uncover answers that could help her find her mother. I havent read the Mortal Instruments or seen the movies. Cassandra Clare who writes the MI series started out as a fanfic author, her series The Draco Trilogy, which I never read, is apparently iconic. The problem seems that she plagiarized much of the story, stealing quotes and scenes from shows like Buffy and the like. And the MI series is basically her taking The Draco trilogy and slapping the HP characters into the world she created. I remember reading a few discussions about it on Tumblr. She then wrote another series that was basically the MI in Victorian times. And now has another 3 book deal and is extending the MI to add 3 more books, even though the trilogy was wrapped up nicely. This article sums it up pretty well. bellumina.wordpress.com/2012/03/14/049-why-i-have-a-problem-with-cassandra-clare-why-you-should-too/ "....True, if anyone remembers reading The Draco Trilogy online way back in the day, you’ll also remember that Clare posted disclaimers about quotes she’d taken from sources like Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Blackadder. But if you Google Clare’s name, you’ll find countless sites, blogs, forums, and even wikis devoted to explaining how she plagiarized most of her work — and then got herself published on the basis of this plagiarized work. And they’re not wrong. Although as far as I am aware, the plots of her fanfiction were still her own (or at least mostly), the writing, which was snappy, witty, and often laugh out loud hilarious, was often not hers. The hysterical quotes my friends and I would giggle about were most often taken (and changed very slightly) from other books, films, or television shows, and often whole chunks of dialogue and description were taken from these sources, with only a line or two attributed. In one chapter, Clare would use countless references and claim them as her own — or at least not specifically explain that they weren’t hers." Sorry that veered wildly from the original question. I find the politics, unwritten rules, behind the scenes scandals, and etiquette of fanfic fascinating.
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Post by miawallace on Jan 3, 2019 16:25:18 GMT -6
Well I saw Draco and then I was in. Thanks for the suggestion. I’ll give it a whirl.
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badwolf
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Post by badwolf on Jan 3, 2019 16:41:40 GMT -6
Meh. It did better in the first few episodes than the movie did in the whole damn thing. It’s still okayish though. The books were a series that I COULD NOT put down. Plus the author is someone who keeps on giving. Prequels. Back story. After books with other characters. All thought out originally. Seriously just go read the books.
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badwolf
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Post by badwolf on Jan 3, 2019 16:42:47 GMT -6
Guess I’ll go back and watch the series now though.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 3, 2019 17:33:35 GMT -6
Meh. It did better in the first few episodes than the movie did in the whole damn thing. It’s still okayish though. The books were a series that I COULD NOT put down. Plus the author is someone who keeps on giving. Prequels. Back story. After books with other characters. All thought out originally. Seriously just go read the books. I dont want to read the books. Im not down with plagiarism and from what I understand and have seen much of what is good from the books is taken from other sources. Like entire scenes and a ton of dialogue. She was even banned from FF.net for it. And a ton of the MI scenes come from her Draco trilogy with is plagiarized AF. But since the show is supposed to veer away pretty good I figured I would give it a chance. Ive also heard the first season kind of suck but seasons 2 and 3 have been much better. This is a very thorough account of said plagiarism. Which I of course dont expect you to read lol, but its interesting. Ive been in a spiral all day. web.archive.org/web/20140802045351/http://www.journalfen.net/community/bad_penny/8985.htmlAnd honestly I want to watch just so I can read the fanfic lol.
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badwolf
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Post by badwolf on Jan 3, 2019 20:54:21 GMT -6
mischief this is what I get for not reading the whole post. I just thought it was a big summary of the books with the link you posted.
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badwolf
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Post by badwolf on Jan 3, 2019 20:58:00 GMT -6
Also now I’m horrified. This was one of my favorite series. Guess I know why now.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 3, 2019 21:33:21 GMT -6
I'll discuss fanfic plagiarizing all day. I don't know much about MI, as I've never been that interested. I am really fascinated by fanfic authors who turn around and then make millions by changing charcter names and settings slightly and them publishing. EL James, I'm looking at you.
Where would one even watch the show?
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Post by miawallace on Jan 3, 2019 21:37:56 GMT -6
I'll discuss fanfic plagiarizing all day. I don't know much about MI, as I've never been that interested. I am really fascinated by fanfic authors who turn around and then make millions by changing charcter names and settings slightly and them publishing. EL James, I'm looking at you. Where would one even watch the show? OOoooh tell me more. Was she a fanfic writer before?
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 3, 2019 21:39:14 GMT -6
I'll discuss fanfic plagiarizing all day. I don't know much about MI, as I've never been that interested. I am really fascinated by fanfic authors who turn around and then make millions by changing charcter names and settings slightly and them publishing. EL James, I'm looking at you. Where would one even watch the show? OOoooh tell me more. Was she a fanfic writer before? Fifty Shades of Grey started out as Master of the Universe, a Twilight fanfic. I read about 5 chapters before I noped right out of it because the writing was so terrible. ETA I should add that I don't Twilight anymore. But there was a time in college.
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Post by miawallace on Jan 3, 2019 21:43:43 GMT -6
OOoooh tell me more. Was she a fanfic writer before? Fifty Shades of Grey started out as Master of the Universe, a Twilight fanfic. I read about 5 chapters before I noped right out of it because the writing was so terrible. ETA I should add that I don't Twilight anymore. But there was a time in college. Aaaaaah. I twilghted for the first movie. I liked the Edward and Bella back and forth. I lost interest by the second movie. I am guilty of reading the fifty shades stuff though. I don’t love them but the smut. Lol But I did not know this. Wow. I’m mind blown I wonder if that fic is still available on some corner of the internet.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 3, 2019 21:47:27 GMT -6
Fifty Shades of Grey started out as Master of the Universe, a Twilight fanfic. I read about 5 chapters before I noped right out of it because the writing was so terrible. ETA I should add that I don't Twilight anymore. But there was a time in college. Aaaaaah. I twilghted for the first movie. I liked the Edward and Bella back and forth. I lost interest by the second movie. I am guilty of reading the fifty shades stuff though. I don’t love them but the smut. Lol But I did not know this. Wow. I’m mind blown I wonder if that fic is still available on some corner of the internet. The internet is forever. Sorry to derail the thread a bit. ohfifty.com/downloads/MOTU_w_Outtakes_Snowqueens_Icedragon_COMPLETE.pdf
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Post by miawallace on Jan 3, 2019 21:49:44 GMT -6
Aaaaaah. I twilghted for the first movie. I liked the Edward and Bella back and forth. I lost interest by the second movie. I am guilty of reading the fifty shades stuff though. I don’t love them but the smut. Lol But I did not know this. Wow. I’m mind blown I wonder if that fic is still available on some corner of the internet. The internet is forever. Sorry to derail the thread a bit. ohfifty.com/downloads/MOTU_w_Outtakes_Snowqueens_Icedragon_COMPLETE.pdfThank you.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 15:27:14 GMT -6
I'll discuss fanfic plagiarizing all day. I don't know much about MI, as I've never been that interested. I am really fascinated by fanfic authors who turn around and then make millions by changing charcter names and settings slightly and them publishing. EL James, I'm looking at you. Where would one even watch the show? Yes this is exactly what Cassandra Clare did. MI is just the Draco Trilogy basically. Shadowhunters is on Hulu.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 15:31:00 GMT -6
I'll discuss fanfic plagiarizing all day. I don't know much about MI, as I've never been that interested. I am really fascinated by fanfic authors who turn around and then make millions by changing charcter names and settings slightly and them publishing. EL James, I'm looking at you. Where would one even watch the show? I am down to discuss too. Its insane to me. Ive seen a few authors on AO3 trying to post work and Im like wait Ive read this before and then go to the comments and its someone reposting someones old work. And I remember I was going to read the MI series so I googled the reviews and one of the reviews was a novel about why the series was a giant rip off. I totally forgot about it until I started watching Shadowhunters videos on youtube.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 4, 2019 15:33:08 GMT -6
I'll discuss fanfic plagiarizing all day. I don't know much about MI, as I've never been that interested. I am really fascinated by fanfic authors who turn around and then make millions by changing charcter names and settings slightly and them publishing. EL James, I'm looking at you. Where would one even watch the show? I am down to discuss too. Its insane to me. Ive seen a few authors on AO3 trying to post work and Im like wait Ive read this before and then go to the comments and its someone reposting someones old work. And I remember I was going to read the MI series so I googled the reviews and one of the reviews was a novel about why the series was a giant rip off. I totally forgot about it until I started watching Shadowhunters videos on youtube. Yeah. There was a Manacled rip off back in like October, and SenLiYu (who writes Manacled) contacted the author, who tried to pretend it was her original work. It was almost word for word the same.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 15:33:15 GMT -6
mischief this is what I get for not reading the whole post. I just thought it was a big summary of the books with the link you posted. Oh also sorry if my post sounded aggressive. I didnt mean it that way at all. lol
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 15:34:25 GMT -6
And then her other series is just MI in Victorian times. And one can assume her new book series will follow a similar vein.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 4, 2019 15:36:07 GMT -6
Fanfic is in a weird space to begin with. They are taking someone's IP and reworking it, so what is the limit there? I'm in a Tamora Pierce Fan FB group and Tammy is a regular contributor there but she does not read or comment on fanfic per the request of her lawyers. It's really tricky. She also won't read anyone's manuscript in case she accidentally reproduces a sentence or whatever in a novel down the road.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 15:51:05 GMT -6
Fanfic is in a weird space to begin with. They are taking someone's IP and reworking it, so what is the limit there? I'm in a Tamora Pierce Fan FB group and Tammy is a regular contributor there but she does not read or comment on fanfic per the request of her lawyers. It's really tricky. She also won't read anyone's manuscript in case she accidentally reproduces a sentence or whatever in a novel down the road. Im of the mind as long as you dont make money off it and arent actively trying to claim it as your own original work then you are okay. So dont be like E.L. James or Cassandra Clare.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 15:52:15 GMT -6
Thats cool about Tamora Pierce though. To be in the FB group about your books. I dig it.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 4, 2019 15:54:40 GMT -6
Fanfic is in a weird space to begin with. They are taking someone's IP and reworking it, so what is the limit there? I'm in a Tamora Pierce Fan FB group and Tammy is a regular contributor there but she does not read or comment on fanfic per the request of her lawyers. It's really tricky. She also won't read anyone's manuscript in case she accidentally reproduces a sentence or whatever in a novel down the road. Im of the mind as long as you dont make money off it and arent actively trying to claim it as your own original work then you are okay. So dont be like E.L. James or Cassandra Clare. Yeah, I don't get how they were able to do it. I mean, I know names and what not are changed, but there is still a lot in there that's not original
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Post by pianolove on Jan 4, 2019 16:08:15 GMT -6
Im of the mind as long as you dont make money off it and arent actively trying to claim it as your own original work then you are okay. So dont be like E.L. James or Cassandra Clare. Yeah, I don't get how they were able to do it. I mean, I know names and what not are changed, but there is still a lot in there that's not original Yeah this boggles my mind. CC's Draco trilogy literally ripped off entire paragraphs and chunks of other people's storylines and she claimed it as her own storyline. Like for instance, we all know HP, Hogwarts, Diagon Alley, other such nouns etc belong to JKR, but the actions taken place also belong to her- escape from Gringotts, Battle of Dept of Mysteries. You can't just rename a few characters, stick them in existing scenes and hope nobody will notice. if MI is just the Draco trilogy with new names, then CC is unethical and a plagiarizer and I won't be supporting that. I can't speak to EL James in personal experience but I've read enough here and elsewhere to feel comfortable in labeling her a plagiarizer as well.
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Post by miawallace on Jan 4, 2019 16:25:41 GMT -6
I had to read some of this in pieces and using a chart of sorts because I got lost. Plus a legend for all the acronyms.
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 4, 2019 16:30:05 GMT -6
Thats cool about Tamora Pierce though. To be in the FB group about your books. I dig it. She's really awesome. She's not been around recently because she's working on her next book, so we're all happy about that, but she always likes cat pics.
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Post by miawallace on Jan 4, 2019 16:34:12 GMT -6
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athn64
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Post by athn64 on Jan 4, 2019 16:41:26 GMT -6
That is a lot of text. But wow to the sentences that are word for word from that other book.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 16:47:15 GMT -6
The second link I shared upthread gets pretty in depth as well and does side by side comparisons of woks she stole from. I believe she is the one who initially reported her for the plagiarism.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 16:49:54 GMT -6
<SNIP> I havent read the Mortal Instruments or seen the movies. Cassandra Clare who writes the MI series started out as a fanfic author, her series The Draco Trilogy, which I never read, is apparently iconic. The problem seems that she plagiarized much of the story, stealing quotes and scenes from shows like Buffy and the like. And the MI series is basically her taking The Draco trilogy and slapping the HP characters into the world she created. I remember reading a few discussions about it on Tumblr. She then wrote another series that was basically the MI in Victorian times. And now has another 3 book deal and is extending the MI to add 3 more books, even though the trilogy was wrapped up nicely. This article sums it up pretty well. bellumina.wordpress.com/2012/03/14/049-why-i-have-a-problem-with-cassandra-clare-why-you-should-too/ "....True, if anyone remembers reading The Draco Trilogy online way back in the day, you’ll also remember that Clare posted disclaimers about quotes she’d taken from sources like Buffy the Vampire Slayer and Blackadder. But if you Google Clare’s name, you’ll find countless sites, blogs, forums, and even wikis devoted to explaining how she plagiarized most of her work — and then got herself published on the basis of this plagiarized work. And they’re not wrong. Although as far as I am aware, the plots of her fanfiction were still her own (or at least mostly), the writing, which was snappy, witty, and often laugh out loud hilarious, was often not hers. The hysterical quotes my friends and I would giggle about were most often taken (and changed very slightly) from other books, films, or television shows, and often whole chunks of dialogue and description were taken from these sources, with only a line or two attributed. In one chapter, Clare would use countless references and claim them as her own — or at least not specifically explain that they weren’t hers." Sorry that veered wildly from the original question. I find the politics, unwritten rules, behind the scenes scandals, and etiquette of fanfic fascinating. This is a nice summary.
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mischief
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Post by mischief on Jan 4, 2019 16:51:30 GMT -6
I spiraled hard on her yesterday. When I start the show Ill start a new thread, maybe Ill rename this one because I can talk about this stuff all day lol.
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