brux
Diamond
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Post by brux on May 22, 2018 18:01:08 GMT -6
On my commute today, I listened to part of a podcast episode that told the story of a group of 70 black and latinx high school kids who were taken to see Shindler’s List in a movie theater. They acted like kids do and they got kicked out of the theater.
It became national news about how these kids were disrespectful of the holocaust when the truth in the moment was more that the kids were bored, under-prepared for the subject matter, and well, kids on a field trip.
There was a part where he kids were forced to apologize in a press conference. The kids apologized for their behavior. The adult Jewish community was displeased as they wanted an apology for the lack of reverence and anti-semitism they felt the kids displayed. Basically two ships crossing in the night.
The kids then got tired of being told to feel like crap about themselves and realized that they were being told to care about the holocaust and Jewish people when no one cared to teach them about the black or Indian genocides that happened in our own country.
What was supposed to be a lesson in tolerance ended up being a national uproar that just seemed to cause lots of lingering bad feelings.
It just felt like a podcast that gave me some insight into the approach to topics/disagreements we find ourselves in here.
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Post by lucilleaustero on May 22, 2018 18:01:39 GMT -6
Thing is, I don’t think all of your overthinking should prevent you from engaging in these discussions. But I also don’t think you need to pummel yourself if you missed an event or opportunity to comment or call out. Nothing wrong with not being the perfect police person. Anyone to suggest otherwise is promoting an impossible standard. When I was 8, I used the n word. I remember specific details. My Uncle J used to use that word all the time. I knew it was a bad word, but not what it actually meant. My father, who did not spare the rod to spoil the child, whooped my ass for that. And once me tears dried, he took me to the library. I learned about obvious racism. It was not until my adulthood that I learned about more insidious forms of racism. Are there things I probably still do that are problematic without knowing? You bet your bottom dollar. This is something all white people need to admit. But, the examples we are talking about in this thread were not hidden, they were pretty obvious.
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brux
Diamond
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Post by brux on May 22, 2018 18:02:37 GMT -6
Good god that anecdote is probably way off base.
It just resonated with me today and I’ve been thinking about Ripper and black women and thisbitch and my own role and real life.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2018 18:05:58 GMT -6
Also don’t be my behind the scenes friend. I can’t live like that. Don’t feel like you have to be rippers friend in her inbox and then on the board snub her. That says more about you than her TBH I agree. FWIW - I liked thisbitch a lot. When she said what she said in that thread my eyes popped a bit, I responded in an effort to gain more clarity and things went downhill from here. She pm’d me to personal apologize and I responded that I don’t take personal offense to these these types of instances. If I were to be personally offended by every micro aggression/racist remark, I wouldn’t be able to function on my day to day. My point is, I still said something. I saw her as a friend and I said something. I don’t care who you are, if you say something off base, I will say something.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2018 18:08:24 GMT -6
Messy train pulling back into the station Hollering
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Pistol
Diamond
Posts: 28,064 Likes: 62,420
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Post by Pistol on May 22, 2018 18:12:14 GMT -6
On my commute today, I listened to part of a podcast episode that told the story of a group of 70 black and latinx high school kids who were taken to see Shindler’s List in a movie theater. They acted like kids do and they got kicked out of the theater. It became national news about how these kids were disrespectful of the holocaust when the truth in the moment was more that the kids were bored, under-prepared for the subject matter, and well, kids on a field trip. There was a part where he kids were forced to apologize in a press conference. The kids apologized for their behavior. The adult Jewish community was displeased as they wanted an apology for the lack of reverence and anti-semitism they felt the kids displayed. Basically two ships crossing in the night. The kids then got tired of being told to feel like crap about themselves and realized that they were being told to care about the holocaust and Jewish people when no one cared to teach them about the black or Indian genocides that happened in our own country. What was supposed to be a lesson in tolerance ended up being a national uproar that just seemed to cause lots of lingering bad feelings. It just felt like a podcast that gave me some insight into the approach to topics/disagreements we find ourselves in here. What podcast is that?
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sterling
Global Moderator
GD
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Post by sterling on May 22, 2018 18:12:33 GMT -6
At the risk of sounding like a fawning fan girl, I cannot overstate the value I believe the black women bring to this forum. This place would suck without you.
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sterling
Global Moderator
GD
Posts: 15,068 Likes: 130,504
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Post by sterling on May 22, 2018 18:15:14 GMT -6
And you’re all really pretty. Too much? Just enough? LMK.
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mack
Amethyst
Posts: 6,437 Likes: 49,767
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Post by mack on May 22, 2018 18:15:31 GMT -6
On my commute today, I listened to part of a podcast episode that told the story of a group of 70 black and latinx high school kids who were taken to see Shindler’s List in a movie theater. They acted like kids do and they got kicked out of the theater. It became national news about how these kids were disrespectful of the holocaust when the truth in the moment was more that the kids were bored, under-prepared for the subject matter, and well, kids on a field trip. There was a part where he kids were forced to apologize in a press conference. The kids apologized for their behavior. The adult Jewish community was displeased as they wanted an apology for the lack of reverence and anti-semitism they felt the kids displayed. Basically two ships crossing in the night. The kids then got tired of being told to feel like crap about themselves and realized that they were being told to care about the holocaust and Jewish people when no one cared to teach them about the black or Indian genocides that happened in our own country. What was supposed to be a lesson in tolerance ended up being a national uproar that just seemed to cause lots of lingering bad feelings. It just felt like a podcast that gave me some insight into the approach to topics/disagreements we find ourselves in here. What podcast was this?
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McBenny
Unicorn
#sickomode
Posts: 52,412 Likes: 297,405
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Post by McBenny on May 22, 2018 18:18:00 GMT -6
The I’m going to do better and listen is bullshit. I don’t believe it when someone says it. They’re just doing their best in the moment to stop being called the big bad R word. I've said before I want allies to step up when I'm not around. I got it if I'm there. Be my voice when I'm not.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2018 18:19:17 GMT -6
Also, I’m not going through life “calling out” every single microagression that I encounter. I am just more inclined to do so for the “I’m woke af” crowd.
Like, honey... you are not though.
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McBenny
Unicorn
#sickomode
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Post by McBenny on May 22, 2018 18:20:47 GMT -6
I can say for myself I had some prejudices in regards to white people. Some stereotyping etc. I have learned a lot from the white women here. I haven't always been perfect. I also have had things said about me with no basis.
All I can say is I will try to be fair and be consistent and not reaction solely for n emotion.
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Post by angrybacon on May 22, 2018 18:20:56 GMT -6
I mean, I don’t really go here much, but I always roll my eyes when white women talk about how they don’t like when ppl call others out, or say that they’re listening and learning. It is a case-by-case basis for me: if someone is constantly called out for racial aggression (micro or macro) and flips their hair and says #listeningandlearning, but then pulls that shit tomorrow, then yeah. You can fuck off with that nonsense.
But if it’s genuine, I don’t think it should be discouraged by other white people. I am not saying that they should receive a parade. But if someone needs to be called out, then do it. And if you learn something, then say it if you are so inclined.
Saying that the word problematic has lost its meaning on this board goes along with that for me: if you are sick of the word, imagine all of the behavior that has been overlooked to accompany it. If you want to pick a different word, go ahead, but it’s commonly used because it is a gentle descriptor of the behavior.
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wasabi
Moderator
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Post by wasabi on May 22, 2018 18:21:48 GMT -6
Also, I’m not going through life “calling out” every single microagression that I encounter. I am just more inclined to do so for the “I’m woke af” crowd. Like, honey... you are not though. This is one of my biggest pet peeves here, the people who are always the first in line to compete in the woke olympics. No I will not name names. But it’s just something I don’t feel like anyone can be too confident about.
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wasabi
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Post by wasabi on May 22, 2018 18:23:21 GMT -6
McBenny my mom and Maya did a fairy garden in my backyard this past weekend 🙈 I thought of you and pictured the side eye emoji
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mack
Amethyst
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Post by mack on May 22, 2018 18:24:16 GMT -6
McBenny my mom and Maya did a fairy garden in my backyard this past weekend 🙈 I thought of you and pictured the side eye emoji Was there hummus?
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McBenny
Unicorn
#sickomode
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Post by McBenny on May 22, 2018 18:24:39 GMT -6
This woman was followed to this board and had her face posted. Is that not harassment? Years later?
I also can't get the whole she called her names but be called names by the same person as well.
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wasabi
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Post by wasabi on May 22, 2018 18:25:45 GMT -6
I mean, I don’t really go here much, but I always roll my eyes when white women talk about how they don’t like when ppl call others out, or say that they’re listening and learning. It is a case-by-case basis for me: if someone is constantly called out for racial aggression (micro or macro) and flips their hair and says #listeningandlearning, but then pulls that shit tomorrow, then yeah. You can fuck off with that nonsense. But if it’s genuine, I don’t think it should be discouraged by other white people. I am not saying that they should receive a parade. But if someone needs to be called out, then do it. And if you learn something, then say it if you are so inclined. Saying that the word problematic has lost its meaning on this board goes along with that for me: if you are sick of the word, imagine all of the behavior that has been overlooked to accompany it. If you want to pick a different word, go ahead, but it’s commonly used because it is a gentle descriptor of the behavior. You could’ve tagged me here. When I say a word has lost meaning it’s because it’s used too often and not enough backed up, that’s all. Like “listening and learning.” Of course those things are important. But back it up. I’m sure I have work to do there too. Which is why I don’t generally come out guns blazing in conversations like these.
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mack
Amethyst
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Post by mack on May 22, 2018 18:26:00 GMT -6
This woman was followed to this Baird and had her face posted. Is that not harassment? Years later? I also can't get the whole she called her names but be called names by the same person as well. Are we talking about Ripper?
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wasabi
Moderator
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Post by wasabi on May 22, 2018 18:26:50 GMT -6
McBenny my mom and Maya did a fairy garden in my backyard this past weekend 🙈 I thought of you and pictured the side eye emoji Was there hummus? No but my dad did put mayo on his burger. (And it wasn’t Dukes)
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McBenny
Unicorn
#sickomode
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Post by McBenny on May 22, 2018 18:27:13 GMT -6
This woman was followed to this Baird and had her face posted. Is that not harassment? Years later? I also can't get the whole she called her names but be called names by the same person as well. Are we talking about Ripper? Not directly but loosely drawing parallels. I feel there was some extra behavior on both sides but I'm still reading threads and Pms.
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mack
Amethyst
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Post by mack on May 22, 2018 18:27:39 GMT -6
No but my dad did put mayo on his burger. (And it wasn’t Dukes) NO HE FUCKING DID NOT
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Post by angrybacon on May 22, 2018 18:28:00 GMT -6
I mean, I don’t really go here much, but I always roll my eyes when white women talk about how they don’t like when ppl call others out, or say that they’re listening and learning. It is a case-by-case basis for me: if someone is constantly called out for racial aggression (micro or macro) and flips their hair and says #listeningandlearning, but then pulls that shit tomorrow, then yeah. You can fuck off with that nonsense. But if it’s genuine, I don’t think it should be discouraged by other white people. I am not saying that they should receive a parade. But if someone needs to be called out, then do it. And if you learn something, then say it if you are so inclined. Saying that the word problematic has lost its meaning on this board goes along with that for me: if you are sick of the word, imagine all of the behavior that has been overlooked to accompany it. If you want to pick a different word, go ahead, but it’s commonly used because it is a gentle descriptor of the behavior. You could’ve tagged me here. When I say a word has lost meaning it’s because it’s used too often and not enough backed up, that’s all. Like “listening and learning.” Of course those things are important. But back it up. I’m sure I have work to do there too. Which is why I don’t generally come out guns blazing in conversations like these. I read the comment, kept reading, and then posted. I didn’t go back to see who had said the thing about problematic. And I just don’t know that we have evolved to a point where white people should discourage other white people from speaking out. This is a general comment, not just directed at you.
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brux
Diamond
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Post by brux on May 22, 2018 18:28:46 GMT -6
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mack
Amethyst
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Post by mack on May 22, 2018 18:31:01 GMT -6
Are we talking about Ripper? Not directly but loosely drawing parallels. I feel there was some extra behavior on both sides but I'm still reading threads and Pms. I agree. By no means am I here to WK ripper but there is some uncouth behavior going on, on both sides. Come for her under your own SN, etc.
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wasabi
Moderator
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Post by wasabi on May 22, 2018 18:31:21 GMT -6
You could’ve tagged me here. When I say a word has lost meaning it’s because it’s used too often and not enough backed up, that’s all. Like “listening and learning.” Of course those things are important. But back it up. I’m sure I have work to do there too. Which is why I don’t generally come out guns blazing in conversations like these. I read the comment, kept reading, and then posted. I didn’t go back to see who had said the thing about problematic. And I just don’t know that we have evolved to a point where white people should discourage other white people from speaking out. This is a general comment, not just directed at you. That’s alright, I didn’t mean to come off as snarky as I did, as I agree with what you’re saying. We shouldn’t discourage it, but it is something that makes me cringe when white women “try too hard” (this is likely an unfair statement from me, but I am just being honest about my feelings, which admittedly may need some working on). It is better to “try too hard” than be a coward so I should again take a step back on my judgments.
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mack
Amethyst
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Post by mack on May 22, 2018 18:31:40 GMT -6
You could’ve tagged me here. When I say a word has lost meaning it’s because it’s used too often and not enough backed up, that’s all. Like “listening and learning.” Of course those things are important. But back it up. I’m sure I have work to do there too. Which is why I don’t generally come out guns blazing in conversations like these. I read the comment, kept reading, and then posted. I didn’t go back to see who had said the thing about problematic. And I just don’t know that we have evolved to a point where white people should discourage other white people from speaking out. This is a general comment, not just directed at you. Maybe me because I am pretty sure I have used the word problematic at least 20 times today.
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Post by leatherpants on May 22, 2018 18:34:41 GMT -6
I also am one that is usually silent in these conversations. For all the reasons people have mentioned, including and most notably some of the problematic ones including not want to be wrong, not wanting to be involved in confrontation and such.
I spend a lot of time in reflection about these threads as I see many others are too. I feel woefully uninformed and uneducated about some of the facets of racism that are discussed. I often have a hard time following the thoughts in the thread, which makes me feel ashamed, dumb and like I’d be a worthless at contributing anything so why bother.
I feel like this is also a worthless post because I’m not looking for anything and I know this is nothing new or insightful.
I do know I have heard everyone loud and clear that reflection is not the end point of anything.
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Post by leatherpants on May 22, 2018 18:36:40 GMT -6
Plus I can’t be concise to save my life. Pet peeve about myself right there.
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Post by sheilathetank on May 22, 2018 18:36:56 GMT -6
Not directly but loosely drawing parallels. I feel there was some extra behavior on both sides but I'm still reading threads and Pms. I agree. By no means am I here to WK ripper but there is some uncouth behavior going on, on both sides. Come for her under your own SN, etc. The way the whole thing went down looked like they wanted to stir drama instead of warning us like they claim. Why would you need an AE to post facts? Stand in your truth. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth. And by facts, I don't mean the screenshots of a person's SM account.
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