To sleep, perchance to dream

[hangry]

How is sleep going?
Nighttime, naps?
How are they falling asleep?
How long are they staying asleep?
How are you creating or avoiding sleep associations?
Have you used a sleep program before? Have a method you follow?
This does not have to be question and answer... just a place to talk about anything related to sleep.

[hangry]

As I said in the weekly thread, sleep is going ok for us. T sleeps from 7:30 to 6:30 ish in his bassinet but wakes 2-3 times. I generally nurse to sleep but then have to hold him upright for a bit because he seems to have some minor reflux. Once that seems settled and he’s in a deep sleep, I can easily put him down.

We aren’t on a nap schedule yet. I just note when he’s tired and put him to sleep. If we’re at home, I rock him to sleep and put him in the bassinet. If I wait til he’s well and asleep, he’ll go down and nap for 45 ish minutes. If we’re out, I’ll use the stroller or carrier to get him to sleep. He loves that. Will sleep for an hour or longer. He often falls asleep while nursing and will grab 20 minute cat naps here and there.
We do not use a pacifier.

Anytime I lay him down drowsy, he grunts and whines and eventually screams every time. Is this what other babies are doing? How long do you leave them like that to get them to learn how to fall asleep??

I used the Sleep Sense program with my first and it worked ok. It didn’t start til 6 months. I just suffered immensely with my second. They still both wake up and we still sit in with them while they fall asleep. It’s just the path of least resistance right now. I really want to have one baby that is just easy. So any tips are appreciated!

[danib]

G has 1 really good nap in the daytime. Start is mid-morning (sometime between 9 and 10, depending on what is happening that morning, what time we get out of bed, if I have to make him wait while I do something with the older boys, etc). That nap is between 3-4 hours long. It's almost always in his swing. I nurse him, he dozes off, I put him in he swing, sometimes he wakes briefly but drifts back to sleep within 10 minutes or so.

The rest of the day is mostly cat naps. He'll fall asleep nursing sometimes and wake up when I try to put him down (or he'll still wake up after a half hour or so even if I keep holding him, I just normally can't because the other boys need attention), sometimes he'll be in his swing chilling while I cook or do other stuff and will doze off for a little while. Never in his carseat. Occasionally in the wrap.

Nighttime he cluster feeds for like 2+ hours (dozes a little between feeds) then settles by 9/10. He'll typically sleep for 4-6 hours, wake for a feed, then back to sleep until 5 or 6. If 5 I can usually get him to have another small cat nap after a feed to get us to 6/7, but if 6 then he's up up.

Even though it's a bit sporadic with the cat naps, I'm happy with it knowing that I get some solid chunks at night and that one consistent big nap in the morning/afternoon.

I don't do any sleep programs. I'm fine with nursing/rocking to sleep if needed (but I totally understand that this does not work for every household). When they get older (like 2ish) I start putting in more firm boundaries around staying in bed, but I base my method off of the kid (all my boys so far have had different sleep needs).

[hangry]

Wowzer to a 3-4 hour nap danib!!

I’ve always nursed the other kids to sleep but know that it tends to lead to a dependence on that and I thought maybe this time I would try to avoid it. I’m torn because it’s easy and relaxing and I like it, except when it might mean their overall sleep is impacted.

[danib]

Aug 13, 2020 8:16:46 GMT -6 hangry said:

Wowzer to a 3-4 hour nap danib!!

I’ve always nursed the other kids to sleep but know that it tends to lead to a dependence on that and I thought maybe this time I would try to avoid it. I’m torn because it’s easy and relaxing and I like it, except when it might mean their overall sleep is impacted.

I don't know that it impacts their overall sleep. I think some kids just sleep well and others don't. Like my sister's son is 5, was never breastfed, and still wakes up in the middle of the night and she has to go lie down with him.
H didn't sleep for more than 45 minutes at a time, day or night, until he was 15 months old and we got his dairy allergy figured out. He was still nursing to sleep and immediately started sleeping fully through the night as soon as the dairy was out of his system.

[danib]

Also, don't most formula fed babies fall asleep when they have their bottle? But no one ever says that causes negative sleep associations. People only say it about breastfeeding.

*I'm just thinking out loud here*

I say do what works for you, whether that's nursing to sleep or something else.

[willow]

Sleep is going really well here but they have been unicorn babies since the beginning, plus we have SNOOs, so take that as you will. They sleep through the night, 7:30pm - 7:00 am, which is when they are woken up, otherwise they might sleep longer but we need to get their day going. They have occasional times where they wake up because they want their pacis back but they go right back to sleep. They nap pretty well too. We just recently transitioned them to cribs for naps from the SNOOs and they nap 4 times a day, and the first three naps are between 1.25-1.5 hours long usually. The last nap is 30-45 min. Our schedule is pretty great actually. 

They fall asleep wide awake. The SNOOs gently rock them so that helps of course, but they are awake when put down. They also fall asleep drowsy but awake for naps in the cribs too. I don't think they have any sleep associations other than the SNOO which I don't know how much fo a sleep association it is. I am contemplating putting them on weaning mode this weekend to see how they do. But they are coming up on 4 months so I am wondering if they will go through the regression or not. We'll see. I'm very lucky this time around. My firstborn was a TERRIBLE sleeper. 

[willow]

We aren't using a sleep program specifically though I have used a hybrid of the TCB and MOC methods together for our daily schedule.

[willow]

Aug 13, 2020 8:27:07 GMT -6 danib said:

Also, don't most formula fed babies fall asleep when they have their bottle? But no one ever says that causes negative sleep associations. People only say it about breastfeeding.

*I'm just thinking out loud here*

I say do what works for you, whether that's nursing to sleep or something else.

It depends on the baby probably and whether they are just tired but yes. My babies usually don't fall asleep on the bottle anymore but some nights they do. But then they wake up again during burping and stuff. 

[danib]

Aug 13, 2020 8:50:34 GMT -6 willow said:

Aug 13, 2020 8:27:07 GMT -6 danib said:

Also, don't most formula fed babies fall asleep when they have their bottle? But no one ever says that causes negative sleep associations. People only say it about breastfeeding.

*I'm just thinking out loud here*

I say do what works for you, whether that's nursing to sleep or something else.

It depends on the baby probably and whether they are just tired but yes. My babies usually don't fall asleep on the bottle anymore but some nights they do. But then they wake up again during burping and stuff. 

oh absolutely, I think pretty much everything is baby specific.
I just started thinking as I was typing. I don't recall hearing any of my mom-friends who formula feed being concerned about baby depending on the bottle to fall asleep. Yet pretty much every breastfeeding mom I know have been told at some point or another not to let baby fall asleep nursing or they will be dependent on it.

[willow]

Aug 13, 2020 6:49:33 GMT -6 hangry said:

As I said in the weekly thread, sleep is going ok for us. T sleeps from 7:30 to 6:30 ish in his bassinet but wakes 2-3 times. I generally nurse to sleep but then have to hold him upright for a bit because he seems to have some minor reflux. Once that seems settled and he’s in a deep sleep, I can easily put him down.

We aren’t on a nap schedule yet. I just note when he’s tired and put him to sleep. If we’re at home, I rock him to sleep and put him in the bassinet. If I wait til he’s well and asleep, he’ll go down and nap for 45 ish minutes. If we’re out, I’ll use the stroller or carrier to get him to sleep. He loves that. Will sleep for an hour or longer. He often falls asleep while nursing and will grab 20 minute cat naps here and there.
We do not use a pacifier.

Anytime I lay him down drowsy, he grunts and whines and eventually screams every time. Is this what other babies are doing? How long do you leave them like that to get them to learn how to fall asleep??

I used the Sleep Sense program with my first and it worked ok. It didn’t start til 6 months. I just suffered immensely with my second. They still both wake up and we still sit in with them while they fall asleep. It’s just the path of least resistance right now. I really want to have one baby that is just easy. So any tips are appreciated!

My babies "talk" for like 2 minutes before falling asleep at night. By talk I just mean their hilarious squawking that happens at this age. It's pleasant and not upset though so I just let it happen. For naps, they get agitated for about 20 seconds before they realize their zipadee zip is on and once they get their pacifier, they fall right asleep. 

I have no good answers because my first born wouldnt nap anywhere but my chest until he was forced at daycare at 5 months and even then he took crappy cat naps all day long. I sleep trained him way too late in retrospect for night time. I basically just did CIO and after that he fell asleep from being wide awake like nothing. But of course 3.5 months is a bit early for that. I plan to sleep train these two in their cribs in the next month or so. 

[willow]

Aug 13, 2020 9:08:31 GMT -6 danib said:

Aug 13, 2020 8:50:34 GMT -6 willow said:

It depends on the baby probably and whether they are just tired but yes. My babies usually don't fall asleep on the bottle anymore but some nights they do. But then they wake up again during burping and stuff. 

oh absolutely, I think pretty much everything is baby specific.
I just started thinking as I was typing. I don't recall hearing any of my mom-friends who formula feed being concerned about baby depending on the bottle to fall asleep. Yet pretty much every breastfeeding mom I know have been told at some point or another not to let baby fall asleep nursing or they will be dependent on it.

I also think, IN GENERAL, formula fed babies sleep through the night earlier and more successfully than many BF babies do. I think this is due partly because BM digests quicker but also because BF is more of a comfort soothing sensation than a bottle is. Of course it is comforting to a baby to have a bottle while being held by mom or dad but it's not the same. Because I had two, I couldn't hold them MOTN so they were on boppys (this was after my H and I started taking shifts and feeding both instead of us each feeding one) so it was not a cuddly time either. 

[txaggie08]

How is sleep going?
Ok. It sucks during the day, but he does fairly well at night. If he does have a good day of naps, then his night sleep suffers, so it's a weird balance. He doesn't sleep as many hours as all the guidance says - probably closer to 12 hours a day.

How are they falling asleep?
Boobs.

If he's super tired then I can put him in the ergo and walk around the house (because we'd die of heat stroke if we went outside).

DH can rock him to sleep, but not me.

How long are they staying asleep?
During the day, his naps average 30 minutes.

How are you creating or avoiding sleep associations?
He won't take a pacifier, even though we've tried. We're borrowing a SNOO from one of DH's coworkers, but it only works for him at night and he has to be asleep to put him down. During the day he wakes up almost immediately.

Have you used a sleep program before?
I don't think we've followed a specific method. DD was a magic unicorn baby who still loves sleeping at age 9 and DS1 slept like crap as a baby and still doesn't sleep well (so I think everything is child-specific).

[trtlcrzy]

hangry you sound exactly like me, ha!

To start, V is 7 weeks so I’m still just following her cues for nursing and sleep. I mostly nurse her to sleep. She falls asleep in the car or stroller if it’s moving, but wakes up shortly after stopping. Within the last week she has started tolerating the swing and will fall asleep in there. I have started trying to lay her down awake or at least without nursing her to sleep. It’s worked a few times, I have to swaddle her and sway. She takes the paci sometimes but not always. She usually cluster feeds from 6ish until 9:30ish and then is out for 3ish hours (except those 2 nights she slept almost 6) then is up every 2-3 hours. During the day she naps off and on. Sometimes they are little cat naps, other times it’s 1-2 hours. I plan to do the sleep sense program with V when she is a little older. It worked great with DD1, but I didn’t actually use it until she was 18 months. DD2 was a tougher case, but it did work for a while. My older girls are 6&4 and wake up in the middle of the night every night and come sleep on my floor so I don’t have a great track record. I’m hoping to get it right this time.

[sdlaura]

Baby Ben (3 months on Saturday) is a pretty great sleeper. His only issue is that he likes a late bedtime - 9:30 pm at the earliest - and it takes way longer to put him down if I try earlier. I miss solo time with DH in the evenings after kids go to bed. He can do the drowsy but awake put down for bedtime in the Snoo - in fact I usually put him in and reswaddle him to make sure he’s not completely asleep since that helps him sleep better.

His normal is go down around 10 pm, one wake up around 4 or 5, and up for the day at 7 or 8. Four times (all in the last 1.5 weeks) he has slept completely through the night with no wake ups - but of course I didn’t sleep that late because I was so engorged. Those nights were 10-11 hours total.

We’re moving the Snoo into his future room this weekend when we shuffle kids’ rooms around. I’m going to try to shift everyone’s bedtimes earlier since school online starts for my older kids Monday and they’ll have to be out of the house at 7:45 am everyday to go to their pod in a friend’s garage.

Baby does not nap well yet. Usually either on me or with me wearing him or in bouncy seat. Every once in a while if he’s really tired I’ll put him in the Snoo and get a long nap.

[wasabi]

How is sleep going?
Ok, nighttime is pretty good, naps could be better

Nighttime, naps?
He’s been going down for the night between 8 and 9, and he’ll wake usually between 4-6, eat, and then go back down until 7ish. Around then I’ll feed him again and sometimes he goes right back to sleep for a bit longer, or he’s up for an hour or so before going back down. His longest nap is in the morning- usually about 2-3 hours. On me, of course. He naps every couple hours after that for shorter times- like 45 mins to an hour. Last night I got another 2.5 hour nap from like 4-630 so that was weird. I guess if the wonder weeks app isn’t complete bullshit then he he going through a leap so maybe that’s it? He has been extra fussy today too 😑


How are they falling asleep?
I was mostly nursing to sleep for bedtime and naps, but now I just do it at bedtime. And occasionally he doesn’t fall right to sleep so I do end up rocking him. He likes to bounce, really. Lol. Sometimes I wish I would’ve bought a yoga ball instead of the rocker. He’s started going to sleep much more easily with a pacifier once I finally found one he likes (mam) but thankfully he’s totally cool to spit it out once he’s asleep and not care to have it while he’s actually been put down. So yeah, bounce him around with a pacifier usually does the trick.

How long are they staying asleep?
At night- One 7-9 hour stretch at night followed by another couple hours.

I’m not doing anything regarding associations or sleep programs. I might be too lazy, lol. I did CIO with my daughter when she was over a year old and I’d like to avoid that but we’ll see.

[hangry]

Ohhh, I forgot about the wonder weeks wasabi. I followed it with my first and quoted it as truth. Now i imagine it would more be, oh, that’s interesting. Is it worth downloading again?

[wasabi]

Aug 13, 2020 17:38:16 GMT -6 hangry said:

Ohhh, I forgot about the wonder weeks wasabi. I followed it with my first and quoted it as truth. Now i imagine it would more be, oh, that’s interesting. Is it worth downloading again?

Eh, I don’t feel like it’s doing anything to help really. But it was kind of interesting today because Miles was weirdly fussier today and I looked at the app and it said he just entered a new leap. So if it is bullshit it’s kinda accurate bullshit, lol. So yeah I guess if that is important to you then it can be pretty interesting, but it’s not something I put high on the needs list for a baby.

[trtlcrzy]

I also glance at the wonder weeks app, but I def don’t arrange my life around it. I like to see what she should be learning and whatnot.

[willow]

I haven't really found the WW to be accurate ever with my babies but who knows. I am annoyed because you can't "add" or "change" babies on the app so it still thinks I am looking at it for my 4 year old which is outdated obviously.

[txaggie08]

When we have a particularly bad night of sleep, I'll Google the WW to see if there's a reason for my lack of sleep. Even if it's BS it makes me feel better in the MOTN if he's at a leap.

*if there's no leap, then I move on to Googling growth spurts. I'll read any nonsense on the internet if it tells me that he'll sleep better soon.

[trtlcrzy]

Aug 14, 2020 7:41:22 GMT -6 willow said:

I haven't really found the WW to be accurate ever with my babies but who knows. I am annoyed because you can't "add" or "change" babies on the app so it still thinks I am looking at it for my 4 year old which is outdated obviously.

You sure can. Click on the pencil above the baby picture and you can add a new child.