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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2017 20:53:45 GMT -6
I’m sure it’s “too soon” to talk policy. 🙄
I’m so done with all this.
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Post by hawkeye2015 on Nov 5, 2017 21:25:33 GMT -6
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Post by Deleted on Nov 5, 2017 22:02:40 GMT -6
1) Of course. 2) How’d he get his hands on a gun? 😡
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Post by GhoatMonket on Nov 5, 2017 22:17:31 GMT -6
1) Of course. 2) How’d he get his hands on a gun? He passed the background check. If ever there should be a poster child of reasons the current system isn't sufficient, this should be it. But it won't be.
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Ls2012
Amethyst
Posts: 7,364 Likes: 32,622
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Post by Ls2012 on Nov 5, 2017 22:38:40 GMT -6
Anyone else feel like they're existing in a constant state of mourning?
There aren't enough adjectives to convey how much this sucks.
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elle
Ruby
Posts: 18,173 Likes: 114,887
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Post by elle on Nov 6, 2017 0:57:32 GMT -6
1) Of course. 2) How’d he get his hands on a gun? Oh, a history of domestic violence? I'm shocked.* If only there was one commonality throughout all these gunmen so we might have some indication as to who might go on a rampage next... *not shocked
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Taitai
Opal
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Post by Taitai on Nov 6, 2017 2:02:02 GMT -6
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Post by cakewench on Nov 6, 2017 4:48:17 GMT -6
This thread:
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 7:53:39 GMT -6
Morning all, Chris Murphy posted on twitter last night that it has been a few weeks since Vegas and America has already forgotten about bump stocks and this issue. Now this happens and it will be front and center for 48 hours until it is forgotten again and nothing will get done. It will get drowned out by Paul Ryan and his F'ed up Tax plan. This is awful. He was an Ex-Airmen and because of that he was cleared for the guns. But again, this is Texas. Attachment DeletedYou don't need a permit to purchase, you don't have to register, you don't have to have a license to own one, there is no assault weapon law, no magazine capacity restriction, and no restrictions on NFA weapons (machine guns/sawed off shotguns, etc). More in the SS. So essentially since he was in the military he got a free pass for his AR-15 (Yet again) to go and indiscriminately kill as many people as possible. And since he was a white guy he was "deranged". And the NRA, Trump, and republicans wet dreams came true when that 1 person came out of his house with his rifle and fired at the shooter. Again that didn't stop him from killing 26 people. That argument is ridiculous and pig headed. I am so sick of this and how we look at this now. It doesn't even phase me. 3% of a small town gets wiped out and we are just going to let that happen with no repercussions. Now even 500 people are shot and hurt weeks before and the gun lobby has our nuts show tight in a vice we are all not citizens, we are eventual victims.
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Post by cakewench on Nov 6, 2017 8:04:05 GMT -6
Morning all, Chris Murphy posted on twitter last night that it has been a few weeks since Vegas and America has already forgotten about bump stocks and this issue. Now this happens and it will be front and center for 48 hours until it is forgotten again and nothing will get done. It will get drowned out by Paul Ryan and his F'ed up Tax plan. This is awful. He was an Ex-Airmen and because of that he was cleared for the guns. But again, this is Texas. You don't need a permit to purchase, you don't have to register, you don't have to have a license to own one, there is no assault weapon law, no magazine capacity restriction, and no restrictions on NFA weapons (machine guns/sawed off shotguns, etc). More in the SS. So essentially since he was in the military he got a free pass for his AR-15 (Yet again) to go and indiscriminately kill as many people as possible. And since he was a white guy he was "deranged". And the NRA, Trump, and republicans wet dreams came true when that 1 person came out of his house with his rifle and fired at the shooter. Again that didn't stop him from killing 26 people. That argument is ridiculous and pig headed. I am so sick of this and how we look at this now. It doesn't even phase me. 3% of a small town gets wiped out and we are just going to let that happen with no repercussions. Now even 500 people are shot and hurt weeks before and the gun lobby has our nuts show tight in a vice we are all not citizens, we are eventual victims. This was the point I was hesitant to make yesterday - this happened in TEXAS. Their "Good guys with guns can stop this from happening" argument is bullshit. The AG of Texas said more people need to arm themselves at church. It's disgusting.
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mack
Amethyst
Posts: 6,437 Likes: 49,767
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Post by mack on Nov 6, 2017 8:10:10 GMT -6
You guys have this all wrong, mental health is the issue, not guns...
(this was sarc just to be clear)
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 8:11:11 GMT -6
Morning all, Chris Murphy posted on twitter last night that it has been a few weeks since Vegas and America has already forgotten about bump stocks and this issue. Now this happens and it will be front and center for 48 hours until it is forgotten again and nothing will get done. It will get drowned out by Paul Ryan and his F'ed up Tax plan. This is awful. He was an Ex-Airmen and because of that he was cleared for the guns. But again, this is Texas. You don't need a permit to purchase, you don't have to register, you don't have to have a license to own one, there is no assault weapon law, no magazine capacity restriction, and no restrictions on NFA weapons (machine guns/sawed off shotguns, etc). More in the SS. So essentially since he was in the military he got a free pass for his AR-15 (Yet again) to go and indiscriminately kill as many people as possible. And since he was a white guy he was "deranged". And the NRA, Trump, and republicans wet dreams came true when that 1 person came out of his house with his rifle and fired at the shooter. Again that didn't stop him from killing 26 people. That argument is ridiculous and pig headed. I am so sick of this and how we look at this now. It doesn't even phase me. 3% of a small town gets wiped out and we are just going to let that happen with no repercussions. Now even 500 people are shot and hurt weeks before and the gun lobby has our nuts show tight in a vice we are all not citizens, we are eventual victims. This was the point I was hesitant to make yesterday - this happened in TEXAS. Their "Good guys with guns can stop this from happening" argument is bullshit. The AG of Texas said more people need to arm themselves at church. It's disgusting. Better screening and common sense could have prevented this. He was dishonorably discharged from the military which should have barred him from having an weapons. He was convicted of domestic abuse which should have disqualified him. He was charged with animal abuse a few years after should have disqualified him. He was now a danger to his new wife and 2 year old child. The system failed the public 3 times. 3 TIMES. All because of Texas laws and NRA lobbying.
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mack
Amethyst
Posts: 6,437 Likes: 49,767
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Post by mack on Nov 6, 2017 8:12:48 GMT -6
This was the point I was hesitant to make yesterday - this happened in TEXAS. Their "Good guys with guns can stop this from happening" argument is bullshit. The AG of Texas said more people need to arm themselves at church. It's disgusting. Better screening and common sense could have prevented this. He was dishonorably discharged from the military which should have barred him from having an weapons. He was convicted of domestic abuse which should have disqualified him. He was charged with animal abuse a few years after should have disqualified him. He was now a danger to his new wife and 2 year old child. The system failed the public 3 times. 3 TIMES. All because of Texas laws and NRA lobbying. I disagree with this. There are many, many reasons that people get dishonorably discharged or separated from the military. A domestic abuse conviction? Absolutely not.
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 8:14:45 GMT -6
Better screening and common sense could have prevented this. He was dishonorably discharged from the military which should have barred him from having an weapons. He was convicted of domestic abuse which should have disqualified him. He was charged with animal abuse a few years after should have disqualified him. He was now a danger to his new wife and 2 year old child. The system failed the public 3 times. 3 TIMES. All because of Texas laws and NRA lobbying. I disagree with this. There are many, many reasons that people get dishonorably discharged or separated from the military. A domestic abuse conviction? Absolutely not. According to NPR, CNN, and most other news agencies this morning he was discharged for domestic violence against his wife and daughter. The charge was bad conduct. I am not saying that a discharge is a reason. I meant the domestic abuse which was why he was discharged was the warning sign. Discharge reasons need to be scrutinized.
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jkjacq
Ruby
Posts: 21,752 Likes: 94,434
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Post by jkjacq on Nov 6, 2017 8:15:34 GMT -6
Morning all, Chris Murphy posted on twitter last night that it has been a few weeks since Vegas and America has already forgotten about bump stocks and this issue. Now this happens and it will be front and center for 48 hours until it is forgotten again and nothing will get done. It will get drowned out by Paul Ryan and his F'ed up Tax plan. This is awful. He was an Ex-Airmen and because of that he was cleared for the guns. But again, this is Texas. You don't need a permit to purchase, you don't have to register, you don't have to have a license to own one, there is no assault weapon law, no magazine capacity restriction, and no restrictions on NFA weapons (machine guns/sawed off shotguns, etc). More in the SS. So essentially since he was in the military he got a free pass for his AR-15 (Yet again) to go and indiscriminately kill as many people as possible. And since he was a white guy he was "deranged". And the NRA, Trump, and republicans wet dreams came true when that 1 person came out of his house with his rifle and fired at the shooter. Again that didn't stop him from killing 26 people. That argument is ridiculous and pig headed. I am so sick of this and how we look at this now. It doesn't even phase me. 3% of a small town gets wiped out and we are just going to let that happen with no repercussions. Now even 500 people are shot and hurt weeks before and the gun lobby has our nuts show tight in a vice we are all not citizens, we are eventual victims. This was the point I was hesitant to make yesterday - this happened in TEXAS. T heir "Good guys with guns can stop this from happening" argument is bullshit. The AG of Texas said more people need to arm themselves at church. It's disgusting. That right there... They will hold the neighbor up as a hero and use him as the example of more armed people can stop a 'bad guy'. Its already a narrative how he possibly stopped him from going to another possible target.
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redbears
Sapphire
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Post by redbears on Nov 6, 2017 9:16:23 GMT -6
I am so enraged and devastated watching the news coverage this morning. I cannot handle the stories about the children and I cannot handle the president's response. I just.....I don't know, need to turn of the TV or something. But that doesn't seem right either.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 6, 2017 9:28:44 GMT -6
Just in reference to the AG suggestion, I know of at least 4 church's (2 in TX) that regularly have multiple armed members just in case of an event like this. Not that a hand gun is going to stop a guy in body armor with an AR. I don't think it's that far off from the norm especially in very conservative churches. (I am not advocating for it, just giving my personal experience)
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joelies
Sapphire
You must chill
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Post by joelies on Nov 6, 2017 9:32:48 GMT -6
The whole "more guns in church" doesn't even make sense in this case when he was shooting from outside. And even had he walked in the door beforehand, he would've had to start shooting before anyone would have had time to stop praying and pull out their gun. So basically... once again a few casualties are the price of freedom? This is appalling.
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Post by enchanted on Nov 6, 2017 10:16:04 GMT -6
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pesto
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Post by pesto on Nov 6, 2017 10:33:01 GMT -6
They've now confirmed that the gunman didn't have a license to carry. I'm feeling really uneasy with the narrative I see developing. First, that he got his guns illegally so gun laws wouldn't have mattered. And also the story about the good guy with a gun chasing him down. When in actuality he had already killed 26 people. Then he fled in his car and shot himself.
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Post by GhoatMonket on Nov 6, 2017 10:52:25 GMT -6
Better screening and common sense could have prevented this. He was dishonorably discharged from the military which should have barred him from having an weapons. He was convicted of domestic abuse which should have disqualified him. He was charged with animal abuse a few years after should have disqualified him. He was now a danger to his new wife and 2 year old child. The system failed the public 3 times. 3 TIMES. All because of Texas laws and NRA lobbying. I disagree with this. There are many, many reasons that people get dishonorably discharged or separated from the military. A domestic abuse conviction? Absolutely not. He shouldn't be automatically approved because he was former military. Nor should anyone be automatically approved because they are current military.
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pesto
Sapphire
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Post by pesto on Nov 6, 2017 10:59:09 GMT -6
TW
They've changed the youngest victim to an 18 month old. Jesus.
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Post by dreadpirateroberts on Nov 6, 2017 12:09:49 GMT -6
You guys have this all wrong, mental health is the issue, not guns... (this was sarc just to be clear) I thought the issue was criminals will still get guns...? Why bother making laws when people will just do what they want anyway? /s
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jkjacq
Ruby
Posts: 21,752 Likes: 94,434
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Post by jkjacq on Nov 6, 2017 12:20:21 GMT -6
You guys have this all wrong, mental health is the issue, not guns... (this was sarc just to be clear) I thought the issue was criminals will still get guns...? Why bother making laws when people will just do what they want anyway? /s You get anarchy and YOU get anarchy EVERYBODY GETS ANARCHY!!!
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 13:16:40 GMT -6
I thought the issue was criminals will still get guns...? Why bother making laws when people will just do what they want anyway? /s You get anarchy and YOU get anarchy EVERYBODY GETS ANARCHY!!! AND YOU GET ANARCHY! AND YOU GET ANARCHY!
Sorry I had to.
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 13:21:11 GMT -6
We can't label what this event was till we know the facts. It is still right now a mentally ill persons attack till we find out all the facts. The narrative at the start to now is all wrong. And to make this worse is listening to the public comment. C-SPAN is inundated by Religions right wing nut jobs talking about its because you took god out of school and government and this is Texas "we do what we want, MERICA". This administration has led to the dumbing down of the United States and just jam it in and make it work. Donald Trump and the republicans are literally raping America. The narrative about the guy hunting him down is all over the place; he is a hero; he shot but he may not have killed him; he may have killed himself, etc. Again as pesto said he may have chased him down but that was after the fact. The damage had been done.
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jkjacq
Ruby
Posts: 21,752 Likes: 94,434
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Post by jkjacq on Nov 6, 2017 13:22:46 GMT -6
We can't label what this event was till we know the facts. It is still right now a mentally ill persons attack till we find out all the facts. The narrative at the start to now is all wrong. And to make this worse is listening to the public comment. C-SPAN is inundated by Religions right wing nut jobs talking about its because you took god out of school and government and this is Texas "we do what we want, MERICA". This administration has led to the dumbing down of the United States and just jam it in and make it work. Donald Trump and the republicans are literally raping America. The narrative about the guy hunting him down is all over the place; he is a hero; he shot but he may not have killed him; he may have killed himself, etc. Again as pesto said he may have chased him down but that was after the fact. The damage had been done. Only because he was white. Period. If he had been anybody else it would have already been labeled a terrorist attack and OMG we need to stop letting brown people into this country.
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 13:26:11 GMT -6
We can't label what this event was till we know the facts. It is still right now a mentally ill persons attack till we find out all the facts. The narrative at the start to now is all wrong. And to make this worse is listening to the public comment. C-SPAN is inundated by Religions right wing nut jobs talking about its because you took god out of school and government and this is Texas "we do what we want, MERICA". This administration has led to the dumbing down of the United States and just jam it in and make it work. Donald Trump and the republicans are literally raping America. The narrative about the guy hunting him down is all over the place; he is a hero; he shot but he may not have killed him; he may have killed himself, etc. Again as pesto said he may have chased him down but that was after the fact. The damage had been done. Only because he was white. Period. If he had been anybody else it would have already been labeled a terrorist attack and OMG we need to stop letting brown people into this country. I totally agree. My first thought when I saw it was a church again my mind first went to if it was a black church. I am so numb to this now. The facts on both ends are ridiculous if it were a POC or a white it is always the extreme at either end. Its ridiculous.
Then you have the callers calling in and saying this is a FBI, CIA, ATF conspiracy. Sigh.
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JukEboX
Sapphire
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 13:33:32 GMT -6
I am loving Chris Murphy right now. He puts so much truth to this. From his site: MURPHY STATEMENT ON SUTHERLAND SPRINGS SHOOTINGThis is what a progressive and well collected statement. We need more of it from responsible and common sense people.
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JukEboX
Sapphire
Posts: 2,505 Likes: 5,338
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Post by JukEboX on Nov 6, 2017 14:06:58 GMT -6
Quick question on this as I read responses from elected officials on Twitter.
Democratic response to shooting: "Thoughts and prayers go out to the families of those lost. If we did something about guns last time this might have been prevented." Republican response to shooting: "Thoughts and prayers go out to the families of those lost. Pray for the (insert event staff/area/etc), first responders and the community."
Which one would you rather hear more of?
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