can you help me?

[vino]

Hiiii! I’m so happy to see you here 💜

Ugh, this shit is the worst. I’ve been there with B regarding bedtime issues and had to put my foot down, I hated ending the day with a fight. I looked into Nanny Jo frost and took the advice of ‘when bedtime routine is done, that’s it. The day is over’. That’s how I communicated it to B.

We used a timer, on my phone that he picked the sound and he presses the 3 minute timer every single night, I stand and chit chat for that and then I’m out. It took 2 days and he got it but damn if those days didn’t suck, I was right around when he turned 3 and I’m sure i still have ptsd from it. I stood outside his room, at our kitchen island with a glass of wine, maybe 12 feet away for reference, and set my expectations WAY low. Every time he got out I would just ho put him back, zero talking, nothing. He lost his damn mind, like flailing, tantruming etc, I stayed calm and had exactly zero emotions, no empathy, sadness, anger, nothing. Just physically put him back.

And yes to the chore chart, we picked the chores together, sometimes he puts a star right away, sometimes it’s at the end of the day and he gets 10 cents per star, so the potential of $5 per week. Every Sunday we count how many he has, count the money and he goes and puts it in his piggy bank, it’s really helped him.

I’m not sure of the logistics but I’d agree to separate them, there’s a thread on GD as someone was just having this issue and there was some great advice.
...found it
howeverithappened.proboards.com/thread/21437/bedtime-troubles

You’ll find something that works, I promise. Keep us posted.

[jewels]

Nov 7, 2018 13:41:39 GMT -6 vino said:

Hiiii! I’m so happy to see you here 💜

Ugh, this shit is the worst. I’ve been there with B regarding bedtime issues and had to put my foot down, I hated ending the day with a fight. I looked into Nanny Jo frost and took the advice of ‘when bedtime routine is done, that’s it. The day is over’. That’s how I communicated it to B.
-snip

This - I have reiterated this to S all the time, and it's helped.  MH isn't as strict with that, and he will call him back in, over and over again.  

[flamingo]

I'm exhausted FOR you reading all that, Sing! I'm sorry you've gotten to this point but I think it's great that you're looking to make some changes.

I've spent a good bit of time on here schilling for John Rosemond and I'll take the opportunity to do it again, lol. I swear by the book lahdeedah mentioned, The Well-Behaved Chlld. He addresses literally every single issue you're having right now sing2phins , even the sharing-room problems. He has a sense of humor but is no-nonsense, and TBH it sounds like that is what you need right now. He writes a syndicated column if you want to check him out online. My H and I both read the book and learned a lot. Any of his strategies that I've employed have been very effective, very quickly.

Generally speaking, I think being on the same page with your H is key--kids figure out real quick when they can divide and conquer. So my first step to tackling this would be to sit down with my H, put our heads together and come up with a plan and some consistent strategies, consequences, etc. 

I also think routine is one of the best things we can do for our children, esp. at bedtime when everyone is tired and cranky. Ditching song/book or whatever would be my last resort. I'm able to use *extra* books as motivation to move more quickly through what we need to do first --teeth, jammies, etc. That helps keep things positive, and gives them the chance for more undivided attention, which at this age is what most kids crave. 

[sing2phins]

Nov 7, 2018 15:09:06 GMT -6 flamingo said:

I'm exhausted FOR you reading all that, Sing! I'm sorry you've gotten to this point but I think it's great that you're looking to make some changes.

I've spent a good bit of time on here schilling for John Rosemond and I'll take the opportunity to do it again, lol. I swear by the book lahdeedah mentioned, The Well-Behaved Chlld. He addresses literally every single issue you're having right now sing2phins , even the sharing-room problems. He has a sense of humor but is no-nonsense, and TBH it sounds like that is what you need right now. He writes a syndicated column if you want to check him out online. My H and I both read the book and learned a lot. Any of his strategies that I've employed have been very effective, very quickly.

Generally speaking, I think being on the same page with your H is key--kids figure out real quick when they can divide and conquer. So my first step to tackling this would be to sit down with my H, put our heads together and come up with a plan and some consistent strategies, consequences, etc. 

I also think routine is one of the best things we can do for our children, esp. at bedtime when everyone is tired and cranky. Ditching song/book or whatever would be my last resort. I'm able to use *extra* books as motivation to move more quickly through what we need to do first --teeth, jammies, etc. That helps keep things positive, and gives them the chance for more undivided attention, which at this age is what most kids crave. 

EXTRA books . . . why has that never occurred to me?  Also, I bought and downloaded that book hours ago.  I'm going to start reading it on my way home on the train.

[flamingo]

Nov 7, 2018 15:22:38 GMT -6 sing2phins said:

Nov 7, 2018 15:09:06 GMT -6 flamingo said:

I'm exhausted FOR you reading all that, Sing! I'm sorry you've gotten to this point but I think it's great that you're looking to make some changes.

I've spent a good bit of time on here schilling for John Rosemond and I'll take the opportunity to do it again, lol. I swear by the book lahdeedah mentioned, The Well-Behaved Chlld. He addresses literally every single issue you're having right now sing2phins , even the sharing-room problems. He has a sense of humor but is no-nonsense, and TBH it sounds like that is what you need right now. He writes a syndicated column if you want to check him out online. My H and I both read the book and learned a lot. Any of his strategies that I've employed have been very effective, very quickly.

Generally speaking, I think being on the same page with your H is key--kids figure out real quick when they can divide and conquer. So my first step to tackling this would be to sit down with my H, put our heads together and come up with a plan and some consistent strategies, consequences, etc. 

I also think routine is one of the best things we can do for our children, esp. at bedtime when everyone is tired and cranky. Ditching song/book or whatever would be my last resort. I'm able to use *extra* books as motivation to move more quickly through what we need to do first --teeth, jammies, etc. That helps keep things positive, and gives them the chance for more undivided attention, which at this age is what most kids crave. 

EXTRA books . . . why has that never occurred to me?  Also, I bought and downloaded that book hours ago.  I'm going to start reading it on my way home on the train.

Ha! 

I hope you will find parts or all of the JR book helpful. He is definitely more old-school than a lot of current parenting gurus, but I really like his approach to certain things. 

[chrisy01]

Hi sing2phins missed you!!!!

We do a chore chart where it has a getting ready for bed option. He gets it if he gets ready for bed without too much trouble. He can lose it if he gets out of bed after the final goodnight.

We keep a fairly rigid routine. Bath, teeth, chore chart, books or songs, tucking in routine. As soon as I tuck him. I say do you need to go potty. The answer is always yes even if he just went. Then he goes to bed. He can get up to turn on his night night elephant if it turns off. He does sing occasionally to himself.

We also do a countdown warning. Either you have 10 minutes, then 5 minutes, 2 minutes or say at the end of this episode it’s time for bed.

You are a great mom and don’t let yourself tell you otherwise. It’s the age.

[wineallthetime]

I missed this yesterday. Hi, Sing! I've missed you. I don't have anything to add that others haven't said (and would you even want advice from the mom who's kid wished for a new mom for his birthday??), but kids are hard and I hope you get some peace and quiet soon. Bedtime struggles are the absolute worst.

[dapostrophe]

So, I was thinking about this because I wrote my response quickly at naptime and just kind of threw a bunch of tips and tricks at you and that might not really have been what you were asking. Just wanted to add how important it is to not be too hard on yourself. I honestly think the only thing that improves us as parents is time and experience. You can rest assured that you are a hundred million times a better parent than I was as a single 22 year old who still went out and partied at night. And guess what? My kid is still pretty awesome. See that's the thing about kids is that they are (thankfully) very resilient and it's never too late. My best tip is to do your best, forgive yourself for the tough times, and take extra good care of yourself. I am a firm believer that a happy mama means a happy family. Your sense of well-being is of utmost importance. When you have a tough day, don't beat yourself up about it. Take yourself out for something relaxing/ uplifting immediately...then come back and apologize to the kids to show them how it's done. Then pat yourself on the back for being a great example of how to be a complicated, nuanced human...with accountability but not shame. Rinse and repeat.

You are an amazing, fantastic mother. That is a fact. And we've got your back on those rough days 😉 You've got this.

[xolastunicornxo]

Hi sing!! I’m glad to see you here, please stay!

I’ve wanted to respond to this for a few days, but I wasn’t in the right headspace. I think you’ve gotten some pretty awesome advice. I can’t speak to melatonin, but your M sounds like my R. He is TOUGH and is constantly testing me. I was literally at the end of my rope and a big problem was he gives 0 fucks. Even when he knows consequences are coming , he doesn’t care in the moment. A friend recommended 1,2,3 magic to me and I’ve started implementing that and it has helped. First of all, it’s helped me keep my cool. Instead of yelling and screaming at him it’s just a 1,2,3... ok time out or ok you lose that. I’m also trying to think before I throw out consequences to make sure I can follow through. (For instance “if I get to three you lose your treat at lunch” as opposed to “if I get to three we are throwing outALL the Halloween candy.” I also have to follow through with consequences even when it’s inconvenient to me. It’s still a struggle, but it has gotten better.

And hugs... you’re a great mom, with great kids!!

[sing2phins]

You guys are really the best. There is so much good advice here, and DH and I are going to try many of the things you recommended. We already started with earning an extra story instead of taking away stories and it seems to have helped the getting ready for bed process go more smoothly.

Our bigger problem, though, is that they kind of go bonkers when the lights go out. I had to cut Maggie's song short last night because she was kicking the wall and talking to Benjamin and generally just being a jerk. DH mentioned that they seem to do better the less time we spend in their room after lights out, so we're going to streamline that part of the night.

Our pedi said she doesn't recommend melatonin for kids unless there are sleep disorders or behavioral problems, and since Maggie and Ben are healthy kids, she would advise against it. She said it's normal for kids this age to get hyperactive around bedtime because either they're overtired or not tired, and suggested moving bedtime earlier or adding or dropping naps to see if that helps.

Thank you, as ever, for the support.

[guster]

I’m glad you saw a little improvement last night. When our kids shared a room, we did Josie‘s bedtime routine outside of the bedroom (in the family room). It was mostly because Charlie would go down first, and then Josie would go in more quietly (most days).

[flamingo]

sing2phins I was wondering about their actual bed *time*, too. Our kids go to bed pretty early (7 for Caroline, 7:30 for Bradley) but bedtime is so smooth...if we wait even 30 minutes or so, it can go downhill. I think your pedi is on to something WRT adjusting bedtime or cutting back on naps, if your kids still nap.