Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 5:59:38 GMT -6
Yeah we have a TV etc board but I thought this was a good topic and I don’t want to miss thoughts from people who don’t go there.
I watched The Social Dilemma last night and it’s got me ruminating. I have been off FB for years but IG is a continuing habit and I’m thinking about trying to break from it.
My hesitation is that it’s full of memories, but I guess nothing is gone forever when it’s owned by MZ, and as long as I write the password down somewhere it can remain a family heirloom account.
Anyone else examining their use of social media right now? I’m trying to decide if this board also counts. I can definitely get addicted to refreshing it at times.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2020 6:13:56 GMT -6
I count this board as social media. If it's online and I'm communicating with others, I count it as SM, for me.
I haven't seen what you watched but I've never taken breaks from FB or IG but I don't find them stressful. I have only the people I want to communicate with and I find it a great way to connect with people who live far away.
I get taking breaks for your MH if it affects it negatively.
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lizblue
Sapphire
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Post by lizblue on Sept 20, 2020 6:15:13 GMT -6
I was hoping someone would start this thread. The movie didn’t really uncover anything I didn’t already know but it did put it together in a really chilling way. Some takeaways for me: -the biggest driver is unregulated capitalism. Profit at all costs. That is our root problem. - I am concerned about the amount of time I am on my device and want to be intentional about that. - I want to really monitor DD’s social media when she is older and I want to instill good habits in her now. She reaches for her iPad when she’s bored just like I reach for my phone. I want to break this.
-it was so chilling to me when they said what if we’re the last generation to know what it was like before.
-I do think without being able to agree on truth or fact is going to breakdown our society completely. It already is.
I don’t know specifically how I’m going to change behaviors yet but I’m thinking about it.
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lizblue
Sapphire
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Post by lizblue on Sept 20, 2020 6:18:12 GMT -6
I count this board as social media. If it's online and I'm communicating with others, I count it as SM, for me. I haven't seen what you watched but I've never taken breaks from FB or IG but I don't find them stressful. I have only the people I want to communicate with and I find it a great way to connect with people who live far away. I get taking breaks for your MH if it affects it negatively. The documentary is about way bigger concepts- you should watch it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2020 6:18:54 GMT -6
I count this board as social media. If it's online and I'm communicating with others, I count it as SM, for me. I haven't seen what you watched but I've never taken breaks from FB or IG but I don't find them stressful. I have only the people I want to communicate with and I find it a great way to connect with people who live far away. I get taking breaks for your MH if it affects it negatively. The documentary is about way bigger concepts- you should watch it. Okay thanks for the rec. I'm pretty pro SM so I may go in biased.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2020 6:21:34 GMT -6
I was hoping someone would start this thread. The movie didn’t really uncover anything I didn’t already know but it did put it together in a really chilling way. Some takeaways for me: -the biggest driver is unregulated capitalism. Profit at all costs. That is our root problem. - I am concerned about the amount of time I am on my device and want to be intentional about that. - I want to really monitor DD’s social media when she is older and I want to instill good habits in her now. She reaches for her iPad when she’s bored just like I reach for my phone. I want to break this. -it was so chilling to me when they said what if we’re the last generation to know what it was like before. -I do think without being able to agree on truth or fact is going to breakdown our society completely. It already is. I don’t know specifically how I’m going to change behaviors yet but I’m thinking about it. I will watch the doc but I wanted to comment on something you said I've heard a lot of people say. I've always been a bit huh at the people who want to reduce their phone/tablet screen time but watch TV for 3 hours a night. I see no difference in activities. If you're neglecting important things to be on your device, yes thats a major issue. But I find my phone to be a leisure activity and would rather play on my phone than watch a movie. I'm not sure I see a big difference cause they're both screens and you're zoning out. I am not posting AT you, your comment reminded me of what I've heard multiple people say.
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adelbert
Amethyst
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Post by adelbert on Sept 20, 2020 6:23:15 GMT -6
I've read one of Jaron Lanier's books and H and I LOVED this documentary. We already knew most of this information but I appreciated all the people they interviewed and I now ordered quite a few of the books that people on the documentary have written.
Basically for us it made us realize that we have to have more restrictions for our 10 year old. It's too much to expect him to handle these algorithms. Basically all social media is either totally off limits or it has serious time limits.
For us my H already isn't on social media. I'm still using IG but just to stay connected with my mom and some friends. I'm trying to do no scrolling and if I struggle with it I try to take a break. I'm on FB but only because of my cookbook club which organizes through it. I rarely post or scroll.
I try to put my phone away as much as possible but I'm always reevaluating how things are going.
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adelbert
Amethyst
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Post by adelbert on Sept 20, 2020 6:26:10 GMT -6
For me this board doesn't count. Sometimes I notice I come here more often and when that happens I try to ask myself why. A lot of times it can provide some nice social interaction on days when I am basically just around the kids and I appreciate that. It isn't good when I use it to avoid something I need to get done but don't feel like doing.
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lizblue
Sapphire
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Post by lizblue on Sept 20, 2020 6:27:04 GMT -6
greenolive the documentary is not about spending to much time on social media or screens and this thread shouldn’t devolve into that. The documentary is about what companies are doing with your data and how they are manipulating your behavior. Told from the perspective of former social media executives. It’s scary and according to them, leading towards civil war and a breakdown of life as we know it. If that sounds dramatic, it’s because it is. Watch the documentary before engaging. It’s worth it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2020 6:28:06 GMT -6
greenolive the documentary is not about spending to much time on social media or screens and this thread shouldn’t devolve into that. The documentary is about what companies are doing with your data and how they are manipulating your behavior. Told from the perspective of former social media executives. It’s scary and according to them, leading towards civil war and a breakdown of life as we know it. If that sounds dramatic, it’s because it is. Watch the documentary before engaging. It’s worth it. Thanks. I'm watching now 🙂
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Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 6:28:43 GMT -6
The documentary is not anti social media. It’s just exposing how unregulated it is, and how effective and dangerous some parts of it are without regulation.
For me, the human psychological factors being used without regulation to keep you scrolling and engaged that are disturbing and problematic. I’m super susceptible to those due to my particular brain.
I think overall I use socials in healthy ways - connecting, learning, laughing a lot.
I left FB about 6 years ago because it was making me feel so bad, and so depressed, and I didn’t understand why. I also had family drama that I was escaping. It came out soon after I deleted it that they we’re running experiments on people’s newsfeeds to see if they could make them more sad/depressed - the findings were yes, they could. That’s... fucked up, man.
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lizblue
Sapphire
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Post by lizblue on Sept 20, 2020 6:29:41 GMT -6
For me this board doesn't count. Sometimes I notice I come here more often and when that happens I try to ask myself why. A lot of times it can provide some nice social interaction on days when I am basically just around the kids and I appreciate that. It isn't good when I use it to avoid something I need to get done but don't feel like doing. I think this board counts for me in the bucket of relying on my phone for distraction. But in other ways I think this board is an interesting microcosm of mostly liberal leaning mothers from all over the country. Yes, we are an echo chamber at times, but there is no algorithm that is selecting our content for us here. I like seeing the different perspectives of actual people, not AI.
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Tlex
Ruby
Posts: 22,759 Likes: 154,991
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 6:33:16 GMT -6
For me this board doesn't count. Sometimes I notice I come here more often and when that happens I try to ask myself why. A lot of times it can provide some nice social interaction on days when I am basically just around the kids and I appreciate that. It isn't good when I use it to avoid something I need to get done but don't feel like doing. I think this board counts for me in the bucket of relying on my phone for distraction. But in other ways I think this board is an interesting microcosm of mostly liberal leaning mothers from all over the country. Yes, we are an echo chamber at times, but there is no algorithm that is selecting our content for us here. I like seeing the different perspectives of actual people, not AI. Imagine how quickly the experience would shift if FB bought proboards. As it stands Tapatalk has *the* worst targeted ads on the internet and I kind of adore that about it.
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adelbert
Amethyst
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Post by adelbert on Sept 20, 2020 6:35:04 GMT -6
For me this board doesn't count. Sometimes I notice I come here more often and when that happens I try to ask myself why. A lot of times it can provide some nice social interaction on days when I am basically just around the kids and I appreciate that. It isn't good when I use it to avoid something I need to get done but don't feel like doing. I think this board counts for me in the bucket of relying on my phone for distraction. But in other ways I think this board is an interesting microcosm of mostly liberal leaning mothers from all over the country. Yes, we are an echo chamber at times, but there is no algorithm that is selecting our content for us here. I like seeing the different perspectives of actual people, not AI. For me it's also a nice connection to mainly North American moms which I otherwise wouldn't have at all.
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adelbert
Amethyst
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Post by adelbert on Sept 20, 2020 6:35:49 GMT -6
I think this board counts for me in the bucket of relying on my phone for distraction. But in other ways I think this board is an interesting microcosm of mostly liberal leaning mothers from all over the country. Yes, we are an echo chamber at times, but there is no algorithm that is selecting our content for us here. I like seeing the different perspectives of actual people, not AI. Imagine how quickly the experience would shift if FB bought proboards. As it stands Tapatalk has *the* worst targeted ads on the internet and I kind of adore that about it. Yes like the ads always make me want to not click😂
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Post by goldenbird on Sept 20, 2020 6:37:41 GMT -6
I should probably stay off FB for awhile. This place I guess is social media? But it's different to me than scrolling through a news feed. I also don't have a social life IRL. I didn't before Covid either. I have one friend that I got together with and I've seen her 3x this year. So I don't really have anything else remotely social to do.
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Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 6:51:20 GMT -6
- deleted long ass anecdotal post not on the topic I really want this thread going on-
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Tlex
Ruby
Posts: 22,759 Likes: 154,991
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 6:52:35 GMT -6
Basically that long ass post said when I’m sad and lonely my online life/scrolling habits become unhealthy.
Big wow lol
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Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 6:55:20 GMT -6
I’m feeling so strongly that I don’t want my kids anywhere near social media until high school, earliest. But my oldest is in grade 1 so I’m obviously unqualified to say how I’ll really handle things. Hearing all those people who work for FB/Twitter say it’s an absolute “no” in their home was powerful.
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adelbert
Amethyst
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Post by adelbert on Sept 20, 2020 6:56:49 GMT -6
Also the scene where the kid was considering talking to the girl but then got a FB alert and spent the school break looking at his phone instead was something that I think probably happens often and it makes me worried for my kids.
Almost every single boy in my son's fifth grade class is playing Brawl Stars. They don't really talk to each other while playing it but the three boys who aren't allowed to play or who don't have a phone yet have told their parents they feel like outsiders and that it's affecting their day as even though phones aren't allowed during the day the boys still spend tons of time talking about it. My oldest son is constantly being suggested even more stupid games through the app and downloading them. They're free to play but that's the problem. Obviously they aren't free they encourage you to watch ads and buy gems. In the end he agreed with us to take a break from the app as he just couldn't stop playing on his own and also wasted quite a bit of his allowance on it.
This is fifth grade and I feel it will only get worse.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2020 6:57:03 GMT -6
Okay I am watching and have thoughts. I am not shocked and kind of knew most of these ideas already without the correct terms.
Social media is designed to keep us interested, engaged and addicted. I don't think this is new information. The CEOs wanting full control to adjust the dials is also not shocking to me. We knew this. They want more money than they know what to do with and this is how they get it. We have tapped into a part of being human to capitalize on this.
I completely agree with the person in this thread that kids/teens don't understand this algorithm and need supervision/restrictions.
My kid is 2 so I have no idea what SM will look like in 10 years. It's frightening.
I will share I'm more addicted to HIH than any other SM. I go on when I'm looking for human connection and conversation and this is where I get it the most. I scroll FB a couple times a day but if it got deleted I would not shed a tear.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 20, 2020 7:00:52 GMT -6
I get notifications from tapatalk so I definitely think of this as SM but its not curated and algorithm as much as FB.
I get a tapatalk notification and I have to check it. DH says get off your phone and I'm on HIH. I am strongly connected to the community here. It's the community I crave.
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Fearsy
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Post by Fearsy on Sept 20, 2020 7:13:05 GMT -6
I watched it and was not super surprised by the information but I did find it very interesting. It did make me worry more about how electronics, SM, etc will impact my children. They are 5 and 3.5 and don’t use any sorts of devices right now. We do admittedly watch a lot of TV. It makes me thankful for places like this where I can connect with people who have BTDT with children older than mine so I can gain valuable knowledge and ideas about how to approach this as they get older.
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Fearsy
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Post by Fearsy on Sept 20, 2020 7:17:07 GMT -6
I’m feeling so strongly that I don’t want my kids anywhere near social media until high school, earliest. But my oldest is in grade 1 so I’m obviously unqualified to say how I’ll really handle things. Hearing all those people who work for FB/Twitter say it’s an absolute “no” in their home was powerful. I felt the same about hearing them say no. Wasn’t it Steve Jobs who wouldn’t let his kids have phones? Also the one guy who said he spent all day creating an environment to suck people in (Pinterest I think?) and then couldn’t get away from it at home.
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Fearsy
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Post by Fearsy on Sept 20, 2020 7:22:07 GMT -6
Also I strongly disagree that this place is anything like Facebook. FB’s algorithms and notifications are customized and change constantly to keep you coming back. Like what they said about collecting your data, learning who you are, and then filtering content based on that. While this place has ads, the other stuff like notifications stay the same. It doesn’t over notify you or change the content based on the length of time and how you spend your time here.
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Post by lunarscallion on Sept 20, 2020 7:29:39 GMT -6
I’m feeling so strongly that I don’t want my kids anywhere near social media until high school, earliest. But my oldest is in grade 1 so I’m obviously unqualified to say how I’ll really handle things. Hearing all those people who work for FB/Twitter say it’s an absolute “no” in their home was powerful. I felt the same about hearing them say no. Wasn’t it Steve Jobs who wouldn’t let his kids have phones? Also the one guy who said he spent all day creating an environment to suck people in (Pinterest I think?) and then couldn’t get away from it at home. A lot of people in the tech industry at all levels. I know of Bill Gates off the top of my head but it’s a pretty common stance for tech families to have.
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Fearsy
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Post by Fearsy on Sept 20, 2020 7:32:53 GMT -6
I felt the same about hearing them say no. Wasn’t it Steve Jobs who wouldn’t let his kids have phones? Also the one guy who said he spent all day creating an environment to suck people in (Pinterest I think?) and then couldn’t get away from it at home. A lot of people in the tech industry at all levels. I know of Bill Gates off the top of my head but it’s a pretty common stance for tech families to have. I think it says a lot about the industry and the impact it has on us.
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Tlex
Ruby
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Post by Tlex on Sept 20, 2020 7:33:27 GMT -6
Also I strongly disagree that this place is anything like Facebook. FB’s algorithms and notifications are customized and change constantly to keep you coming back. Like what they said about collecting your data, learning who you are, and then filtering content based on that. While this place has ads, the other stuff like notifications stay the same. It doesn’t over notify you or change the content based on the length of time and how you spend your time here. I am not in disagreement that it’s a different experience in many ways but I do want to push back a bit about how our data is being collected here - if you’re not paying for it, you are the product is 100% true. Even if you’re just lurking and using a burner email account you are providing data and they can build a pretty good guess at who you “are” and what you will like. Just because they aren’t doing a good job with that data/targeted ads/notifications now doesn’t mean they won’t get there, or aren’t selling that info. And I think we’re all ok with that on some level, especially with the amount of anonymity we can have here.
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Fearsy
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Post by Fearsy on Sept 20, 2020 7:34:18 GMT -6
I get notifications from tapatalk so I definitely think of this as SM but its not curated and algorithm as much as FB. I get a tapatalk notification and I have to check it. DH says get off your phone and I'm on HIH. I am strongly connected to the community here. It's the community I crave. I would really suggest turning off the notifications so perhaps you have a bit of a more organic experience with when to check in here. The attachment you are describing isn't necessarily one others might classify as healthy, and it's a bit more interesting considering how your presence around here is generally received. You fight with a lot of people pretty regularly, so this dynamic you are describing where you obsessively tune in and interact is sort of alarming, tbh. This. You said it very eloquently. Also if you (olives) aren’t able to see the difference between what you described about HIH and how it impacts you and watching a 3 hour movie, then there’s much bigger things at play. Some major stuff to digest.
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Post by Notarobot on Sept 20, 2020 7:37:22 GMT -6
I watched it Friday night. Not overly surprising but did inch up my level of alarm. The line about how if we aren't paying for a service, then we are the product keeps circling in my head. Our attention is the product. And our brains are still generally the same as they were while the technology has improved exponentially and we are just not equipped to fight against it - in fact, we generally don't even know what's going on on the other side of the screen. I don't know how this is going to go unless there is regulation. But with the amount of money they bring in, I am skeptical anything will happen.
I used to think it would be key to educate kids about digital literacy and safety online, mental health etc. I still think those things are important, but this doc made me realize that our brains will never catch up to the speed at which these platforms are learning. We need regulation.
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